The Goat Pen

Collectivism and Individualism are two poles on a continuum, and just about everybody falls somewhere in between.

Even the most hard core conservative believes in a lot of collectivist ideas, like common national defense and tax breaks for the collection of wealthy people and big business.

Likewise, even the most loony liberal believes in indivualist things, like the individual's right to get high and have sex with anything with an orifice.

You don't know any socialists, wiz. And what little bit you know about economic systems and political philosophy you got out of your Weekly Reader. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

I can point you towards some good reference works on the subject, if you're serious about wanting to learn.

THE_WIZARD_ wrote:It’s Collectivism vs. Individualism
Copyright © 2010 By Ray Thomas

People think the basic conflict today is between liberals and conservatives. It’s not. It’s between believers in collectivism and those who believe in individualism.

Which side is responsible for our wars of occupation, our declining civil liberties, and Wall street run amuk?

What sides are you referring to Ed? I'm not a Republican. I'm a Libertarian.

WW2 - FDR
Korean - Truman
Vietnam - LBJ

Speaking of civil rights, I guess business owners do not have any.

http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/to ... count.html

WWI - Wilson
Serbia - Slick Willie
Libya - Oprama (from 30,000 ft up)

Gulf War 1 - Bush Sr.
Gulf War 2 - Bush Jr.

The point is that even the most left, or socialistic, of our Presidents were occupiers as much as neocons.

sardis wrote:Speaking of civil rights, I guess business owners do not have any.

http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/to ... count.html

Sucks for PA.

TN allows discounts for church bulletins, firing-range and gun receipts, military and police, AARP, AAA, Elks, Moose, Shriners, healthclub, Farm Bureau - you name it. Take your UT Vols ticket stub and get a free appetizer at Texas Roadhouse.

we're Tennesseeans - discrimination is in our dna

Professor Tiger wrote:Gulf War 1 - Bush Sr.
Gulf War 2 - Bush Jr.

Afghanistan - Bush Jr.
Civil War - Abe Lincoln
Spanish-American War - McKinley


Vietnam - Eisenhower sent the first U.S. troops to South Vietnam
Vietnam - Nixon campaigned on ending the Vietnam War in 1968 and won. 4 years later he pledged to do the same, and won.
Vietnam - The last U.S. troops left Saigon in 1975.

bluetick wrote:

sardis wrote:Speaking of civil rights, I guess business owners do not have any.

http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/to ... count.html

Sucks for PA.

TN allows discounts for church bulletins, firing-range and gun receipts, military and police, AARP, AAA, Elks, Moose, Shriners, healthclub, Farm Bureau - you name it. Take your UT Vols ticket stub and get a free appetizer at Texas Roadhouse.

we're Tennesseeans - discrimination is in our dna

None of that is descrimination. Anybody can walk into any church and pick up a bulletin. Nothing said they had to go to church, nor did they have to claim to be a Christian. Just show a church bulletin.

They are using a bastardization of a federal and state law combined.

Don't worry, the Feds will be all over this and soon they will make sure this is the norm across the US, no discounts for any church period. This whitehouse will be all over that if they get wind of it. But it will be OK to give discounts to mosques and whatever satinists use, just not churches when the Oprama administration gets through with us.

Vietnam - Eisenhower sent the first U.S. troops to South Vietnam
Vietnam - Nixon campaigned on ending the Vietnam War in 1968 and won. 4 years later he pledged to do the same, and won.
Vietnam - The last U.S. troops left Saigon in 1975.

Vietnam - Saigon falls to the NVA in 1975.

bluetick wrote:

Professor Tiger wrote:Gulf War 1 - Bush Sr.
Gulf War 2 - Bush Jr.

Afghanistan - Bush Jr.
Civil War - Abe Lincoln
Spanish-American War - McKinley


Vietnam - Eisenhower sent the first U.S. troops to South Vietnam
Vietnam - Nixon campaigned on ending the Vietnam War in 1968 and won. 4 years later he pledged to do the same, and won.
Vietnam - The last U.S. troops left Saigon in 1975.

LOL, you are a piece of work. Eisenhower was against sending combat troops into Vietnam, sent a few hundred advisors. Combat troops were sent under LBJ. To put the blame on Nixon is like blaming Oprama for Afghanistan.

Big Orange Junky wrote:

bluetick wrote:

sardis wrote:Speaking of civil rights, I guess business owners do not have any.

http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/to ... count.html

Sucks for PA.

TN allows discounts for church bulletins, firing-range and gun receipts, military and police, AARP, AAA, Elks, Moose, Shriners, healthclub, Farm Bureau - you name it. Take your UT Vols ticket stub and get a free appetizer at Texas Roadhouse.

we're Tennesseeans - discrimination is in our dna

None of that is descrimination. Anybody can walk into any church and pick up a bulletin. Nothing said they had to go to church, nor did they have to claim to be a Christian. Just show a church bulletin.

They are using a bastardization of a federal and state law combined.

Don't worry, the Feds will be all over this and soon they will make sure this is the norm across the US, no discounts for any church period. This whitehouse will be all over that if they get wind of it. But it will be OK to give discounts to mosques and whatever satinists use, just not churches when the Oprama administration gets through with us.

I went to the comment section of that article hoping some numbskull would go off on oprama about the PA injustice. Unfortunately they were an astute crowd - 60 comments and no mention of the prez.

thanks for picking up the slack, BOJ - heh

sardis wrote:

bluetick wrote:

Professor Tiger wrote:Gulf War 1 - Bush Sr.
Gulf War 2 - Bush Jr.

Afghanistan - Bush Jr.
Civil War - Abe Lincoln
Spanish-American War - McKinley


Vietnam - Eisenhower sent the first U.S. troops to South Vietnam
Vietnam - Nixon campaigned on ending the Vietnam War in 1968 and won. 4 years later he pledged to do the same, and won.
Vietnam - The last U.S. troops left Saigon in 1975.

LOL, you are a piece of work. Eisenhower was against sending combat troops into Vietnam, sent a few hundred advisors. Combat troops were sent under LBJ. To put the blame on Nixon is like blaming Oprama for Afghanistan.

Eisenhower sent armed uniformed soldiers to S. Vietnam - hundreds. The fact stands.
The comments re: Nixon are also factual. Your reference to "blame on Nixon" is suggests a subjective miscalculation on your part.

Kabul falls to the Taliban in 2014.

Baghdad falls to the Al Sadr militia in 2015.

I went to the comment section of that article hoping some numbskull would go off on oprama about the PA injustice. Unfortunately they were an astute crowd - 60 comments and no mention of the prez.

thanks for picking up the slack, BOJ - heh

Obviously you didn't read my post. I didn't say he was doing anything.

I said they were using a bastardized combination of Federal and state law and once the Feds got a whif of it they would then be all over it and make it federal.

Obviously he has shown there is absolutely nothing he doesn't want the feds to control, whether it be energy, private property, car manufacturing, and healthcare. Nothing is off limits to him and if they give him this idea I have no doubt he would gladly jump on board with it.

I didn't say he had anything to do with what was going on though, just said he would jump at the chance if he got it.

Nice try though.

So 7 years after Nixon pledged to end Vietnam it was finally over? 7 years?!!! That was just one war. 7 years. How many years has it taken Obama to close up 2 wars or at least set agreed upon deadlines? 7?

Obama doesn't want Kabul or Baghdad to fall to their insurgencies before the election. Or at least during the Dem convention.