The Goat Pen

It's a toughie. I can see both sides.

In the end it's about accountability, imo. People have to be individually responsible for their healthcare, and the costs their healthcare entails. To that end there has to be a penalty for a person shirking that responsibility. Call it a tax if you will.

At least there's a consensus that the old way wasn't working.

"This just makes it imperative to get The Anoited One out of office...so we don't get more liberal judges on the SCOTUS."

Yeah, no more liberal justices like Roberts. LMAO...

We are there my friends...

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.”
― Alexis de Tocqueville

bluetick wrote:It's a toughie. I can see both sides.

In the end it's about accountability, imo. People have to be individually responsible for their healthcare, and the costs their healthcare entails. To that end there has to be a penalty for a person shirking that responsibility. Call it a tax if you will.

At least there's a consensus that the old way wasn't working.

Look at tick espousing personal responsibility now. Isn't that cute.

So in essence now the congress has UNLIMITED authority to tax anything it wants to correct? They can tax income, activity, inactivity, property, anything they choose to simply by making it a choice to take the action we demand of you or pay a tax.

The only remedy now is elections, but when half the people pay no federal taxes what incentive do they have to care?

Oh you are obese...join a gym or pay a tax.

What kind of food you eat. Tax or don't eat them.

Visit the doctor x number of times a year or pay a tax.

Freedom died today.

Drama Queen

Roberts: It is not our job to protect the people from the consequences oftheir political choices.

So in essence..you elected the dumb fucks. You go fix it.

Rat you are the epitome of the muppet geezers. I tried to engage you in an actual conversation not that long ago and your response was: I don't care. I'm just here to heckle.

So if my healthcare at work sucks ass and is really expensive (500+ a month for a 6,000 deductible and then 80/20) and I choose not take it, I have to pay a tax/fine. So if I pay that tax/fine, am I covered by the Government plan? If not, do I look at getting my own plan (which I have looked into and is MUCH worse and costly) but I make way to much money to get on Medicaid and other programs? So does this force the Health Care Industry ( I know really broad subject here) to regulate what they can charge, provide, and such? Will there be a cap on what is out of my pocket with my individual each pay check?

I am just asking because I am ignornant to this. How does this help me or does it?

"It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. "

I appreciate what de Tocqueville is getting at with his observation, but I'm scratching my head as to how it is relevant to a situation where the government is forcing people to pay for their own health insurance...

Ironies in life abound.

"In the hour after the SCOTUS decision was revealed, donations poured into [the Romney] campaign, with some estimates exceeding $200,000," a spokesman for the former Massachusetts governor exhorted. Romney drew cheers at his campaign stops throughout the week as he pledged to dismantle Obamacare on his first day in office

Before obamacare there was romneycare. The former is a carbon-fucking-copy of the latter. Romney was for the mandate before he was against it. You could do a blind taste-test between the two 'cares' on the street and nobody could tell the difference.

Both leave in place the major insurance systems: employer-provided insurance, Medicare for seniors and Medicaid for the poor.

Both seek to reduce the number of uninsured by expanding Medicaid and by offering tax breaks to help moderate-income people buy insurance.

Both require citizens to buy insurance or pay a penalty, a mechanism called the individual mandate. And companies that don't offer insurance have to pay fines, with exceptions for small business and a few other cases.

Yeah. Who better to dismantle obamacare than the guy who supplied the blueprint. lol

“If you are a family making less than $250,000 a year, your taxes will not go up.” (quote from President Obama, 2008)


LMAO. You voted for this America...unbelievable.

puterbac wrote:Roberts: It is not our job to protect the people from the consequences oftheir political choices.

So in essence..you elected the dumb fucks. You go fix it.

EFZ

Evidently your conservative goldenboy John Roberts thought this whole thing was perfectly kosher under the constitution. Why not rag on him?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... gBzmoo9izw

Obama promises to Georgy Porgy he will not raise taxes on the middle class...

It must be disconcerting for "conservatives" (LMAO), as so well represented by PNNery (again, LMAO), to be slapped down by someone (Roberts) who they considered "one of us". Of course, why rage at Roberts when they can just blame Obama?

Read Roberts opinion dumbass...he doesn't say that Obamacare is constitutional...he says this is actually a tax thus not governed by the Commerce Clause. He weaseled his way out by basically agreeing with the right in that Obamacare cannot be justified via the Commerce Clause...but that it is actually a tax that our fucked up congress passed (ok I am paraphrasing there)...thus it is a TAX.

He is playing Pontious Pilate by washing his hands of it and telling the American people that if you don't like it...don't vote for the morons (ok...I paraphrased again).

Roberts = Weasel

hedge wrote:"It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. "

I appreciate what de Tocqueville is getting at with his observation, but I'm scratching my head as to how it is relevant to a situation where the government is forcing people to pay for their own health insurance...

Because what Roberts said: It is not our job to protect the people from the consequences oftheir political choices.

He in essence said you elected the people that passed it. Un-elect them if you want. Okay fine. But on tax and spending we are the point where a majority of people will pay no federal income taxes. Therefore they have no incentive or skin in the game to care about taxes and spending cause they already pay nothing, yet they receive all the services of the federal govt for "free".