College Football
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aTm
- Muad'Dib
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Re: College Football
Mexico continues a new found tradition for having multiple players suspended from tournaments as 8 of their Copa America squad gets sent home for a "party with hookers at the hotel" incident in Ecuador.
Sure, I could have stayed in the past. I could have even been king. But in my own way, I am king.
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TheBigMook
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Re: College Football
Heh, my nephew is visiting Ecuador this summer. He may be there right now.
THE OG SSG
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TheBigMook
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Jungle Rat
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Re: College Football
O-H-PUKE
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Hizzy III
- Junior
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Re: College Football
OhNO!
From the town of Possum's Paw, Alabama, standing 6'2" and weighing 150 lbs, the one, the only, the legend... Bootney Farnsworth.
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Ron Mexico
- Sophomore
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Re: College Football
Copa America time! Unfortunately, Talent failed to come through with some sort of financial contest, but that won't reduce my interest level. Nice preview here: http://www.threematchban.com/Articles/a ... and-brazil
ARGENTINA
Argentina have not won a senior International title since the 1993 Copa America, a staggeringly long trophy-drought when the quality of players and teams produced in the interim is considered.
Not only that, for the cliches are true: football is like religion in Argentina, part of the fabric of everyday life, always on TV, in the papers, in peoples conversations. For thousands of tourists in Buenos Aires – arguably the greatest football city on earth, with dozens of clubs and decades of rich, beautiful history – a trip to see Boca Juniors or River Plate is a big part of being in Argentina. Domestic clubs are still successful in South America: Estudiantes won the Copa Libertadores in 2009, while Independiente won the Copa Sudamerica last year, but the national team, for all its stars, its lovely football and its air of football royalty, needs to win a trophy.
There have been plenty in the past: two World Cups, at home in 1978 for Cesar Menotti’s pure example of short-passing attacking Argentine football led by Mario Kempes and Daniel Passarella, and in Mexico in 1986 when Diego Maradona declared himself possibly the greatest player of all time by dragging Carlos Bilardo’s side to the title. There have been 14 Copa America titles, mostly from the 1920s to the 50s, with 1991 and 1993 the most recent successes. Add to that a couple of recent Olympic titles for the Under-23 squads (with three senior players in each tournament) in 2004 and 2008, and you have an undoubted football superpower in need of some silverware.
And Argentina have come close in the last decade. Losing the last two finals to Brazil says something about the volatile football chemistry between the two nations, and about a recent Argentinean inferiority complex. In Peru in 2004, Marcelo Bielsa’s side dominated much of the game and led approaching the final whistle before a last ditch Adriano goal sent the match to penalties where Andreas D’allessandro and Gabriel Heinze missed the first two kicks, the Brazilians missed none, and Argentina went home empty-handed. In 2007, Alfio Basile’s side played some sparkling tiki-tiki (the Argentinean equivalent of tiki-taka) football, manipulated by the genius of Juan Roman Riquelme all the way to the final, where Dunga’s brusquely antifutbol second-string side kicked and counter-attacked them out of the tournament on the end of a humiliating 3-0 scoreline.
More or less that same team, but managed by Jose Pekarman, had played the best football of the 2006 World Cup in Germany – everybody will remember their six goal demolition of Serbia & Montenegro and more particularly Esteban Cambiasso’s immortal goal from that game – only to lose out on penalties to an average German side in the quarter-finals after Pekarman lost his nerve and substituted a dominant Riquelme with Argentina in control and in front. Then came Maradona’s farcical spell in charge which included a row with Riquelme, dozens of players called up for pointless friendlies and ultimately another World Cup quarter-final exit at the hands of Germany. Only this defeat was a harrowing and deserved 4-0, with Maradona’s tactics and selection both criticised in the aftermath.
Maradona is gone, replaced by his old teammate from 1986 and 1990, Sergio Batista. Batista enjoyed success as coach of Argentina’s youth sides, leading the Under-23s – a side including Riquelme and Javier Mascherano as overage players – to that 2008 Olympic Gold, and took over the senior side full-time after his brief spell as caretaker was judged a success, containing as it did a notable and stylish 4-1 spanking of world champions Spain. He knows many of the young players in the squad from the youth teams, but despite the incredible depth of talent at his disposal, he has inherited a few significant problems from Maradona’s spell at the helm.
Chief amongst those problems is how to get the best from Lionel Messi (top). He is regarded differently in Argentina, where his move to Barcelona as a boy makes him a “Catalan” and the fact that he never played for an Argentinean club is seen as almost suspicious. He is not popular in the same way that Carlos Tevez, Boca Juniors icon and man of the people, is, for instance. But his immense talent is undeniable, and the national team needs to serve and harness it in the same way Barcelona do if they are to achieve anything in this tournament. Batista’s predecessors took different routes with Messi. Both Pekarman and Basile had to accommodate him alongside Riquelme, so he was kept out on the wing with the Boca Juniors playmaker as the number ten, in the centre. Batista did something similar when he had both at the Olympics, although Messi was encouraged to wander infield more and link up with Riquelme, with successful results. Maradona preferred a 4-4-2 with Messi at the tip of a midfield diamond, in what had been Riquelme’s role as the enganche. However his other selections sabotaged his own formation, leaving “la pulga” isolated and frustrated in difficult games, especially that 4-0 defeat to a rampant Germany.
Batista instead opts for a 4-3-3 and deploys Messi as a “false nine,” front and centre of the attack, where he can do most damage. That way he is close to the penalty area and ready for one of his little surging runs or to link with a teammate, but also free to drop deeper and drag defenders with him in search of the ball. With his ability to create chances from nothing, he is likely to add to the 16 goals he has scored in his 56 caps.
On the flanks Batista seems to have settled on Ezequiel Lavezzi of Napoli and Angel DiMaria of Real Madrid, both pacy, direct and goal-hungry young players who can beat a full-back and seem to understand Messi and his methods. But the Argentine bench is fully stocked with forwards, including Tevez, Gonzalo Higuain, Diego Milito and Sergio Aguero, each of whom offers something slightly different to the team, from Tevez’s energy and incisive dribbling, Higuain’s aerial ability and movement, Milito’s strength at holding the ball up to Aguero’s intelligence and sublime technique in front of goal. If the team can get the ball to these attacking players, Argentina will score goals.
But getting the ball to them is not as simple as it sounds, since Batista favours the solidity provided by three defensive midfielders, relying on Messi to link, create and finish.
That midfield is built around the solid base provided by Mascherano. For my money the best holding player in the world, he remains terrifically aggressive in his hustling and tackling, positionally disciplined, and calm and precise in his distribution. A first season with all-conquering Barcelona can only benefit Argentina, as it has seen the national team’s captain play as centre-half and learn to alter his duties in his own position when he replaced Sergio Busquets in defensive midfield. In South Africa he frequently found himself overrun in the middle of the pitch and even he struggled to cope, a struggle that defeated him against Germany. That was down to the players Maradona put around him: while Juan Sebastian Veron controls possession, his mobility is significantly reduced from his more athletic pomp, and when he was dropped Mascherano found Maxi Rodriguez and DiMaria beside him in midfield. Both fine players, but neither particularly strong defensively, their attacking forays left huge gaps for Germany and Mexico to play into.
Batista plays Valencia’s hugely talented Ever Banega (above) as his most advanced defensive midfielder, while Esteban Cambiasso of Inter Milan seems to be his first choice for the other midfield spot. Banega is an all-rounder, emerging in the number five role at Boca Juniors in his teens, but capable of playing further forward. His passing is superb – he will probably have more of the ball than anybody else in Argentina’s games, always open, always varying his touches, allowing the team to play everything through him, rarely giving it away, capable of some silken football and always looking to link up with the forwards – but he is a willing runner too, defending and tracking back remorselessly through games. His interplay with Messi in recent games has been lovely to behold. Cambiasso is similar in workrate and ability to retain possession but perhaps slightly more defensive in outlook, and together with Mascherano they are a formidable unit.
If Batista needs to, the more creative option of Javier Pastore (below) waits in reserve. The Palermo star is the closest thing the squad has to a classic Argentinian playmaker, and his pace and trickery, allied with the passing ability of Banega and Messi’s genius, seem a mouth-watering prospect, albeit one we may only see if Batista gets desperate.
Fernando Gago of Real Madrid and Anderlecht’s Lucas Biglia, both hard-working and technically sound defensive midfielders, are instead the most likely replacements for any of the first choice midfield trio, with Diego Valeri of Lanus and Enzo Perez, just sold by Estudiantes to Benfica, being the two more attacking options who were excluded when squad was cut from 26 to 23.
Defence has long been where Argentina have had problems, which accounts for Batista favouring such a solid midfield. Lacking an outstanding centre-half in the absence of the injured Walter Samuel, Batista has generally opted for experience over some promising youngsters. Spartak Moscow’s Nicolás Pareja will start if recovered from injury, but if not the central defenders will probably be Nicolas Burdisso of Roma and Barcelona’s Gabriel Milito. Both 30, and with 78 caps between them, they are good readers of the game, solid in the air, strong in the tackle and comfortable playing the ball out of defence. Neither is particularly quick, and the danger is that the likes of Neymar and Falcao could panic this defence with pure pace.
There is a similar situation on the right side where the legendary Javier Zanetti will drag his 38 year old frame up and down the wing all tournament, creating chances, providing leadership and setting an example as he adds to his 141 caps. His weakness is also pace, a problem in a fullback, even one as experienced and wily as “Pupi”. Young Marcos Rojo of Spartak is the most likely to take the left back slot, and he is fast enough over the ground, adventurous in attack and level-headed enough to suggest that the problems will more likely emanate from the other areas of defence, unless anyone can exploit his relative inexperience. Pablo Zabaleta of Manchester City can replace either fullback with equal efficiency and steel, and AZ’s Sergio Romero has grown into his role as First choice in goal.
Argentina, then, go into the tournament as favourites, based on the presumption of home advantage and the quality of their squad. They will probably play some scintillating football, score many goals and make it to the later stages. But their defensive inadequacies may tell when they face the tougher opposition, and even the firepower they have upfront might not be enough to compensate. The pressure of playing in Argentina before expectant crowds could also affect them in a negative way.
However, they do possess some sparkling talents, and the young man who is currently the best player in the world and already one of the greatest of all time.
They can, undoubtedly, with this competition. It should be fascinating to see if they do.
ARGENTINA
Argentina have not won a senior International title since the 1993 Copa America, a staggeringly long trophy-drought when the quality of players and teams produced in the interim is considered.
Not only that, for the cliches are true: football is like religion in Argentina, part of the fabric of everyday life, always on TV, in the papers, in peoples conversations. For thousands of tourists in Buenos Aires – arguably the greatest football city on earth, with dozens of clubs and decades of rich, beautiful history – a trip to see Boca Juniors or River Plate is a big part of being in Argentina. Domestic clubs are still successful in South America: Estudiantes won the Copa Libertadores in 2009, while Independiente won the Copa Sudamerica last year, but the national team, for all its stars, its lovely football and its air of football royalty, needs to win a trophy.
There have been plenty in the past: two World Cups, at home in 1978 for Cesar Menotti’s pure example of short-passing attacking Argentine football led by Mario Kempes and Daniel Passarella, and in Mexico in 1986 when Diego Maradona declared himself possibly the greatest player of all time by dragging Carlos Bilardo’s side to the title. There have been 14 Copa America titles, mostly from the 1920s to the 50s, with 1991 and 1993 the most recent successes. Add to that a couple of recent Olympic titles for the Under-23 squads (with three senior players in each tournament) in 2004 and 2008, and you have an undoubted football superpower in need of some silverware.
And Argentina have come close in the last decade. Losing the last two finals to Brazil says something about the volatile football chemistry between the two nations, and about a recent Argentinean inferiority complex. In Peru in 2004, Marcelo Bielsa’s side dominated much of the game and led approaching the final whistle before a last ditch Adriano goal sent the match to penalties where Andreas D’allessandro and Gabriel Heinze missed the first two kicks, the Brazilians missed none, and Argentina went home empty-handed. In 2007, Alfio Basile’s side played some sparkling tiki-tiki (the Argentinean equivalent of tiki-taka) football, manipulated by the genius of Juan Roman Riquelme all the way to the final, where Dunga’s brusquely antifutbol second-string side kicked and counter-attacked them out of the tournament on the end of a humiliating 3-0 scoreline.
More or less that same team, but managed by Jose Pekarman, had played the best football of the 2006 World Cup in Germany – everybody will remember their six goal demolition of Serbia & Montenegro and more particularly Esteban Cambiasso’s immortal goal from that game – only to lose out on penalties to an average German side in the quarter-finals after Pekarman lost his nerve and substituted a dominant Riquelme with Argentina in control and in front. Then came Maradona’s farcical spell in charge which included a row with Riquelme, dozens of players called up for pointless friendlies and ultimately another World Cup quarter-final exit at the hands of Germany. Only this defeat was a harrowing and deserved 4-0, with Maradona’s tactics and selection both criticised in the aftermath.
Maradona is gone, replaced by his old teammate from 1986 and 1990, Sergio Batista. Batista enjoyed success as coach of Argentina’s youth sides, leading the Under-23s – a side including Riquelme and Javier Mascherano as overage players – to that 2008 Olympic Gold, and took over the senior side full-time after his brief spell as caretaker was judged a success, containing as it did a notable and stylish 4-1 spanking of world champions Spain. He knows many of the young players in the squad from the youth teams, but despite the incredible depth of talent at his disposal, he has inherited a few significant problems from Maradona’s spell at the helm.
Chief amongst those problems is how to get the best from Lionel Messi (top). He is regarded differently in Argentina, where his move to Barcelona as a boy makes him a “Catalan” and the fact that he never played for an Argentinean club is seen as almost suspicious. He is not popular in the same way that Carlos Tevez, Boca Juniors icon and man of the people, is, for instance. But his immense talent is undeniable, and the national team needs to serve and harness it in the same way Barcelona do if they are to achieve anything in this tournament. Batista’s predecessors took different routes with Messi. Both Pekarman and Basile had to accommodate him alongside Riquelme, so he was kept out on the wing with the Boca Juniors playmaker as the number ten, in the centre. Batista did something similar when he had both at the Olympics, although Messi was encouraged to wander infield more and link up with Riquelme, with successful results. Maradona preferred a 4-4-2 with Messi at the tip of a midfield diamond, in what had been Riquelme’s role as the enganche. However his other selections sabotaged his own formation, leaving “la pulga” isolated and frustrated in difficult games, especially that 4-0 defeat to a rampant Germany.
Batista instead opts for a 4-3-3 and deploys Messi as a “false nine,” front and centre of the attack, where he can do most damage. That way he is close to the penalty area and ready for one of his little surging runs or to link with a teammate, but also free to drop deeper and drag defenders with him in search of the ball. With his ability to create chances from nothing, he is likely to add to the 16 goals he has scored in his 56 caps.
On the flanks Batista seems to have settled on Ezequiel Lavezzi of Napoli and Angel DiMaria of Real Madrid, both pacy, direct and goal-hungry young players who can beat a full-back and seem to understand Messi and his methods. But the Argentine bench is fully stocked with forwards, including Tevez, Gonzalo Higuain, Diego Milito and Sergio Aguero, each of whom offers something slightly different to the team, from Tevez’s energy and incisive dribbling, Higuain’s aerial ability and movement, Milito’s strength at holding the ball up to Aguero’s intelligence and sublime technique in front of goal. If the team can get the ball to these attacking players, Argentina will score goals.
But getting the ball to them is not as simple as it sounds, since Batista favours the solidity provided by three defensive midfielders, relying on Messi to link, create and finish.
That midfield is built around the solid base provided by Mascherano. For my money the best holding player in the world, he remains terrifically aggressive in his hustling and tackling, positionally disciplined, and calm and precise in his distribution. A first season with all-conquering Barcelona can only benefit Argentina, as it has seen the national team’s captain play as centre-half and learn to alter his duties in his own position when he replaced Sergio Busquets in defensive midfield. In South Africa he frequently found himself overrun in the middle of the pitch and even he struggled to cope, a struggle that defeated him against Germany. That was down to the players Maradona put around him: while Juan Sebastian Veron controls possession, his mobility is significantly reduced from his more athletic pomp, and when he was dropped Mascherano found Maxi Rodriguez and DiMaria beside him in midfield. Both fine players, but neither particularly strong defensively, their attacking forays left huge gaps for Germany and Mexico to play into.
Batista plays Valencia’s hugely talented Ever Banega (above) as his most advanced defensive midfielder, while Esteban Cambiasso of Inter Milan seems to be his first choice for the other midfield spot. Banega is an all-rounder, emerging in the number five role at Boca Juniors in his teens, but capable of playing further forward. His passing is superb – he will probably have more of the ball than anybody else in Argentina’s games, always open, always varying his touches, allowing the team to play everything through him, rarely giving it away, capable of some silken football and always looking to link up with the forwards – but he is a willing runner too, defending and tracking back remorselessly through games. His interplay with Messi in recent games has been lovely to behold. Cambiasso is similar in workrate and ability to retain possession but perhaps slightly more defensive in outlook, and together with Mascherano they are a formidable unit.
If Batista needs to, the more creative option of Javier Pastore (below) waits in reserve. The Palermo star is the closest thing the squad has to a classic Argentinian playmaker, and his pace and trickery, allied with the passing ability of Banega and Messi’s genius, seem a mouth-watering prospect, albeit one we may only see if Batista gets desperate.
Fernando Gago of Real Madrid and Anderlecht’s Lucas Biglia, both hard-working and technically sound defensive midfielders, are instead the most likely replacements for any of the first choice midfield trio, with Diego Valeri of Lanus and Enzo Perez, just sold by Estudiantes to Benfica, being the two more attacking options who were excluded when squad was cut from 26 to 23.
Defence has long been where Argentina have had problems, which accounts for Batista favouring such a solid midfield. Lacking an outstanding centre-half in the absence of the injured Walter Samuel, Batista has generally opted for experience over some promising youngsters. Spartak Moscow’s Nicolás Pareja will start if recovered from injury, but if not the central defenders will probably be Nicolas Burdisso of Roma and Barcelona’s Gabriel Milito. Both 30, and with 78 caps between them, they are good readers of the game, solid in the air, strong in the tackle and comfortable playing the ball out of defence. Neither is particularly quick, and the danger is that the likes of Neymar and Falcao could panic this defence with pure pace.
There is a similar situation on the right side where the legendary Javier Zanetti will drag his 38 year old frame up and down the wing all tournament, creating chances, providing leadership and setting an example as he adds to his 141 caps. His weakness is also pace, a problem in a fullback, even one as experienced and wily as “Pupi”. Young Marcos Rojo of Spartak is the most likely to take the left back slot, and he is fast enough over the ground, adventurous in attack and level-headed enough to suggest that the problems will more likely emanate from the other areas of defence, unless anyone can exploit his relative inexperience. Pablo Zabaleta of Manchester City can replace either fullback with equal efficiency and steel, and AZ’s Sergio Romero has grown into his role as First choice in goal.
Argentina, then, go into the tournament as favourites, based on the presumption of home advantage and the quality of their squad. They will probably play some scintillating football, score many goals and make it to the later stages. But their defensive inadequacies may tell when they face the tougher opposition, and even the firepower they have upfront might not be enough to compensate. The pressure of playing in Argentina before expectant crowds could also affect them in a negative way.
However, they do possess some sparkling talents, and the young man who is currently the best player in the world and already one of the greatest of all time.
They can, undoubtedly, with this competition. It should be fascinating to see if they do.
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Jungle Rat
- The Pied Piper of Crazy
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Re: College Football
Why is Mexico such a faggot?
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Ron Mexico
- Sophomore
- Posts: 332
- Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:04 pm
- College Hoops Affiliation: Prairie View A&M
Re: College Football
Crazy opener, Bolivia was 40/1 to win and they damn near pulled it off. Aguero saved a point for Argentina and looks like he probably ought to wind up in the team, but they really couldn't seem to come up with much in the final third against a weak opponent. Might just be a case of Argentina needing some time to get things going, obviously that's what they're hoping, but another effort like this and the pressure will really build locally. Lucky for them it's damn near impossible not to make it out of the group with this tourney format. The English stream on Youtube didn't seem so bad, although it lagged behind the live broadcast on Telefutura, unsurprisingly.
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Jungle Rat
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Re: College Football
For some reason there was an old bus representing Ohio State University in our parade today. Some weirdo waving out the window. Wearing Gator gear I made him wave at me with respect. After he did I asked him if Tressel was under his bus. The fucker gave me the finger. In front of all those kids. I win.
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hedge
- Legend
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Re: College Football
[youtube]lQngj516J1U[/youtube]
I want someone's ass blistered in the middle of Thanksgiving Square.
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Fifer
- Junior
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Re: College Football
In Cincinnati? I'm surprised the bus wasn't overturned and burned.Jungle Rat wrote:For some reason there was an old bus representing Ohio State University in our parade today. Some weirdo waving out the window. Wearing Gator gear I made him wave at me with respect. After he did I asked him if Tressel was under his bus. The fucker gave me the finger. In front of all those kids. I win.
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eCat
- Mr. Pissant
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Re: College Football
I got caught up in a parade in Anderson on Beechmont. I didn't know they did that.
Stupid parade kept me from going to Uno's.
Stupid parade kept me from going to Uno's.
I like the stinky pinky but only up to the first knuckle, I do not want a GD thumb up there--I've told her multiple times and I always catch her when she tries to pull a fast one---it's my butthole for Chrissakes I'm gonna know--so cut out the BS.
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TheBigMook
- Henchman #1
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eCat
- Mr. Pissant
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Re: College Football
I'm not driving to Anderson to play cards
I like the stinky pinky but only up to the first knuckle, I do not want a GD thumb up there--I've told her multiple times and I always catch her when she tries to pull a fast one---it's my butthole for Chrissakes I'm gonna know--so cut out the BS.
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Jungle Rat
- The Pied Piper of Crazy
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Re: College Football
That's the first time I've ever seen anything Ohio State in the Montgomery parade.
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crotch
- Senior (Citizen)
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Re: College Football
Rumor going around these parts that Phil Fulmer's daughter has enrolled at UK and the Fulmer's have bought a house in Lexington. Anyone know if this is true? If so, Joker had better win the SEC East this season.
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Ron Mexico
- Sophomore
- Posts: 332
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Re: College Football
Surprised Mackey lasted as long as he did, considering that he was in such poor health for a long time. Interesting timing, what with the retired players looking for additional help from the league.
Unrelated (other than that this is the proper thread), but Van Nostron will be pleased to know that Sergio Romero (brother of Diego) saved the albiceleste from a humiliating defeat to Colombia last night. If the format wasn't such a joke, they'd be in serious danger of not advancing out of the group stage though...
Unrelated (other than that this is the proper thread), but Van Nostron will be pleased to know that Sergio Romero (brother of Diego) saved the albiceleste from a humiliating defeat to Colombia last night. If the format wasn't such a joke, they'd be in serious danger of not advancing out of the group stage though...