The Goat Pen

innocentbystander wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:37 pm

Tree wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:21 pm

eCat wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:16 pm ok, you have a right to cost effective health care

from a entity that is required to have a balanced budget at the end of each year.

lets see how this plays out

they should pass a law that says people should get a free college education, a home that costs $150K and a 2012 or better Toyota Camry while they are at it.

In all fairness it would be trivial to do with single payer system and cut out the insurance companies that provide no goods or services and are just playing a shell game with our lives.

In all fairness, without health insurance companies, there would be no profit motive. Without a profit motive, you have no Research and Development. With no R and D, you have no breakthroughs. With no breakthroughs, the improvements to our lives (in health care) come to a screeching halt. The end.

We don't need a profit motive when it comes to people's health, dingus.

aTm wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:32 pmTrivial

Obviously not trivial to implement since both parties are on the take, but if we could do it hypothetically, we would likely stop paying the most per capita and getting the least quality healthcare of any 1st world country.

Tree wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:21 pm

eCat wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:16 pm ok, you have a right to cost effective health care

from a entity that is required to have a balanced budget at the end of each year.

lets see how this plays out

they should pass a law that says people should get a free college education, a home that costs $150K and a 2012 or better Toyota Camry while they are at it.

In all fairness it would be trivial to do with single payer system and cut out the insurance companies that provide no goods or services and are just playing a shell game with our lives.

a blank check from the government or controlled costs from the government

yea, that's not gonna work and to say it would be trivial.....c'mon

eCat wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:10 pm

Tree wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:21 pm

eCat wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:16 pm ok, you have a right to cost effective health care

from a entity that is required to have a balanced budget at the end of each year.

lets see how this plays out

they should pass a law that says people should get a free college education, a home that costs $150K and a 2012 or better Toyota Camry while they are at it.

In all fairness it would be trivial to do with single payer system and cut out the insurance companies that provide no goods or services and are just playing a shell game with our lives.

a blank check from the government or controlled costs from the government

yea, that's not gonna work and to say it would be trivial.....c'mon

OK fine, let's just keep paying the most for the least service because eCat read a rightie talking point on some stupid website. The dream is over. Long live the corporations!

the bottom line is that a government run single payer system would have to implement cost controls

that's not a rightie talking point, thats ECON 101, because a single player system removes competition opening up the government to paying huge cost increases to the point they set fixed prices for medical care and drugs.

Now lets say the government does implement cost controls on public sector health providers that answer to investors. Who is going to keep a hospital open if there is no profit margin?

You want government run hospitals like the VA?

yea, rightie talking points......

eCat wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:34 pm the bottom line is that a government run single payer system would have to implement cost controls

that's not a rightie talking point, thats ECON 101, because a single player system removes competition opening up the government to paying huge cost increases to the point they set fixed prices for medical care and drugs.

Now lets say the government does implement cost controls on public sector health providers that answer to investors. Who is going to keep a hospital open if there is no profit margin?

You want government run hospitals like the VA?

yea, rightie talking points......

Your Econ 101 is all a big talking point, obviously. The VA has much better service for better prices and a shocking lack of millions going bankrupt trying to stay alive. Socialism wins, sorry.

Israel now using robotic weapons to take out Palestinian protesters/rock throwers.

https://abcnews.go.com/International/wi ... k-93392154

Tree wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:04 pm

innocentbystander wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:37 pm

Tree wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:21 pm

In all fairness it would be trivial to do with single payer system and cut out the insurance companies that provide no goods or services and are just playing a shell game with our lives.

In all fairness, without health insurance companies, there would be no profit motive. Without a profit motive, you have no Research and Development. With no R and D, you have no breakthroughs. With no breakthroughs, the improvements to our lives (in health care) come to a screeching halt. The end.

We don't need a profit motive when it comes to people's health, dingus.

Little boy, the profit motive is the SOLE REASON why pharmaceutical companies spend so much money on life saving drug research. It is only AFTER a drug hits the US market (for quite some time) to these silly, willy-nilly social states in Europe and Canada can add that drug (that we invented here) to their single-payer government systems.

If we don't make it here, they don't ever get it there. Its that simple. Young man. No, go away and let the adults talk.

Fun Fact: I have learned that I am a direct descendant of the first Jew in the New World, Elias Legarde.

Rat, Mazel Tov!

"until I met her blonde friend. Also a jew which is rare & I guess I was. A blonde jew."

You could've probably passed for a Hitler Youth in Germany in the 30's and 40's. Much like Metzger...

innocentbystander wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 12:14 am

Tree wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:04 pm

innocentbystander wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 9:37 pm

In all fairness, without health insurance companies, there would be no profit motive. Without a profit motive, you have no Research and Development. With no R and D, you have no breakthroughs. With no breakthroughs, the improvements to our lives (in health care) come to a screeching halt. The end.

We don't need a profit motive when it comes to people's health, dingus.

Little boy, the profit motive is the SOLE REASON why pharmaceutical companies spend so much money on life saving drug research. It is only AFTER a drug hits the US market (for quite some time) to these silly, willy-nilly social states in Europe and Canada can add that drug (that we invented here) to their single-payer government systems.

If we don't make it here, they don't ever get it there. Its that simple. Young man. No, go away and let the adults talk.

Crazy how the Covid vaccine was developed in at the University of Oxford

Shalom DS. The shitty fish & bagels are over there.

At least 40 U.S. veterans died waiting for appointments at the Phoenix Veterans Affairs Health Care system, many of whom were placed on a secret waiting list.

The secret list was part of an elaborate scheme designed by Veterans Affairs managers in Phoenix who were trying to hide that 1,400 to 1,600 sick veterans were forced to wait months to see a doctor, according to a recently retired top VA doctor and several high-level sources.

For six months, CNN has been reporting on extended delays in health care appointments suffered by veterans across the country and who died while waiting for appointments and care. But the new revelations about the Phoenix VA are perhaps the most disturbing and striking to come to light thus far.

Internal e-mails obtained by CNN show that top management at the VA hospital in Arizona knew about the practice and even defended it.

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Econ 101

Tell me you guys would sit back and be quiet about this if this was Trump's administration
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The Biden administration says Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman’s high office should shield him from a lawsuit over his role in the killing of a U.S.-based journalist, making a turnaround from President Joe Biden’s passionate campaign trail denunciations of the prince over the brutal slaying.

The administration spoke out in support of a claim of legal immunity from Prince Mohammed — Saudi Arabia’s de facto ruler, who also recently took the title of prime minister — against a suit brought by the fiancée of slain Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi and by the rights group Khashoggi founded, Democracy for the Arab World Now.

“Jamal died again today,” Khashoggi’s fiancée, Hatice Cengiz, tweeted after the U.S. filing late Thursday in her lawsuit.

The U.S. government’s finding of immunity for the Prince Mohammed, sometimes known as MBS, is non-binding, and a judge will ultimately decide whether to grant immunity. But it angered rights activists and risked blowback from Democratic lawmakers. The U.S move came as Saudi Arabia has stepped up imprisonment and other retaliation against peaceful critics at home and abroad and has cut oil production, a move seen as undercutting efforts by the U.S. and its allies to punish Russia for its war against Ukraine.

The State Department on Thursday called the administration’s call to shield the Saudi crown prince from U.S. courts in Khashoggi’s 2018 killing “purely a legal determination.” It cited what it called longstanding precedent.

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if only American had focused on continued oil production , Biden would actually get to have principles

Jungle Rat wrote: ↑Thu Nov 17, 2022 8:04 pm Does she give good head?

Yes...

Well, MBS -- and likely all of the co-defendants -- probably has a really strong 12(b)(1) defense for lack of personal jurisdiction due to the lack of minimum contacts. There is head of state and act of state immunity.

As for the head of state and state action immunity, we glanced over that in federal practice for a day or so, and thus I'm going to avoid really hanging my hat there. However, I will say that based upon my limited memory and understanding, he probably has a great shot at getting that, especially if the US government is saying those immunities apply (the government's position is one of the important factors iirc).

eCat wrote: ↑Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:38 am At least 40 U.S. veterans died waiting for appointments at the Phoenix Veterans Affairs Health Care system, many of whom were placed on a secret waiting list.

The secret list was part of an elaborate scheme designed by Veterans Affairs managers in Phoenix who were trying to hide that 1,400 to 1,600 sick veterans were forced to wait months to see a doctor, according to a recently retired top VA doctor and several high-level sources.

For six months, CNN has been reporting on extended delays in health care appointments suffered by veterans across the country and who died while waiting for appointments and care. But the new revelations about the Phoenix VA are perhaps the most disturbing and striking to come to light thus far.

Internal e-mails obtained by CNN show that top management at the VA hospital in Arizona knew about the practice and even defended it.

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Econ 101

I'm all too familiar with the right's econ 101. Unregulated markets will sort out everything, NAFTA will trade manufacturing jobs for better white collar ones that we'll get in return, etc. It's all lies. All about getting enough people on board with the evil shit that will make and grow corporate profits.

Imagine if we could take our current system, remove the insurance companies which do nothing but suck billions of dollars out of the system every year, remove the extra administrative costs of a multi-payer system (which is the better part of a trillion dollars), put price controls on big pharma who are currently allowed to operate like a mafia, and put all that extra money into actual healthcare that keeps people alive and well. There's your real econ 101. There are articles all over the internet that explain how it would work, get us better care, and be cheaper than the current abortion of a healthcare system that's last in the first world. Look it up.

If everyone would fast for one 36 hour period per week (longer if possible, but at least 36 hours), their health would improve dramatically. But nobody is going to push that b/c it doesn't cost anything (actually saves you money) and it's effective. Free and easy doesn't get a lot of ink. Big pharma needs sick people and Coke, Pepsi, Phillip Morris, etc, etc, need people to suck down their poison daily, so they'd never be onboard with it

This is why censorship doesn't work. I hope the DNC considers this the next time they decide to let/have social media ban someone they don't agree with, even if it's an obvious liar like Trump. The Repubs will then take it and do what they always do, which is to make it 100 times worse, i.e. banning people who are speaking the truth.

Lmao at “professors are priests of democracy.”

What a load of horseshit. Professors are researchers, educators, and also con artists. They include foreigners, communists, fascists. Democracy is nowhere to be found on a University campus, even in the halls of the retards that learn how to be professional grifters in the hallowed traditions of “student government”

Perhaps if the government of Florida should not have any oversight over these “priests,” perhaps also Florida should not pay their fucking salaries either.