The Goat Pen

Also, just to be fair, I think Bibi should demand that the US return to it's 1845 borders, giving all those illegals their rightful homeland (Texas, California etc), back. In addition, the Jews should insist that the US negotiate with the natives, still held on reservations, for creation of a Native American Homeland with borders consistent with the lines agreed to in 1763.

Next, the Jews should ask the UN to consider the plight of those whose ancestors where tossed out of their homes when the Arabs migrated across the Middle East and North Africa from the 3rd to the 6th century.

Lastly, Bibi should insist that Obama withdraw US troops from their various occupations in Asia, Europe and the Middle East. After all, freedom and self determination cannot thrive under occupation.

Red Bird wrote:Not true, Spacer. When the Jew bastards agreed to get out of Gaza, Bush promised we'd support them keeping parts of Judea and Samaria. Now Obama is playing the back end of a bait and switch game. Who us? We never did!

It's plain by Obama's comments that he's willing to sacrifice Israel in his attempt to grab some credit for the Arab Spring.

The Jews will never agree to the pre-67 armistice lines. Such realignment would leave them vulnerable to a surprise attack cutting the nation in half. If the Arab Palestinian squatters insist on petitioning the UN for recognition, then the Jews should unilaterally impose a border that they can defend and tell Obama to kiss their hyme asses.

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, probably not. You're talking out the side of your neck (ask Bkln if you want to know that that is). Bush said essentially the same thing. Multitudes of reporters on virtually all stations have made this very point. Basically the 1967 borders with offsets for parts of Judea and most (not all) of Jeruselum. This is the same as Obama. Israel is a superpower compared to every other country in the region. The idea that Israel is or can be sacrificed is one of delusion to keep ignorant people scared. It ain't happening.

As for the Jews, (it really isn't about "The Jews"), it's about the country of Israel where we give a lot of money to, who we give defacto cover for them to subjugate a large group of people (a small percentage of them terrorists). Israel can do what it wants, but we don't need to cover them with money or in the UN.

Red Bird wrote:Lastly, Bibi should insist that Obama withdraw US troops from their various occupations in Asia, Europe and the Middle East. After all, freedom and self determination cannot thrive under occupation.

Tell him to say that publicly. Please, oh please.

In 2004, in a letter to then Israeli PM Arial Sharon, American President George W. Bush stated that: "realities on the ground prevent a return to the pre-1967 lines and all previous peace talks have reached the same conclusion." It's was plainly understood by the Israelis that Bush was agreeing that the US would not pressure Israel to return to the 1943 armistice demarcation as part of an agreement to withdraw from the Gaza strip.

Why the Jews would have wanted to remain in Gaza is beyond any understanding, but I guess they did squeeze something out of Bush in return for leaving hell for the Arabs to enjoy in peace if they chose to.

Tell him to say that publicly. Please, oh please.

Do you imagine that I talk to Bibi? LOL

What do you suppose might be the benefit of Bibi making such a demand?

I suppose it would be funny, which was my point. I suppose Obama wouldn't like it, but screw him. He can't do anything to Israel. He can't even threaten to cut them off. He needs the Jews more than they need him and they know it.

Bibi told Obama to drop dead when he demanded they stop building settlements and this will end the same way.

The actual letter:

As part of a final peace settlement, Israel must have secure and recognized borders, which should emerge from negotiations between the parties in accordance with UNSC Resolutions 242 and 338. In light of new realities on the ground, including already existing major Israeli populations centers, it is unrealistic to expect that the outcome of final status negotiations will be a full and complete return to the armistice lines of 1949, and all previous efforts to negotiate a two-state solution have reached the same conclusion. It is realistic to expect that any final status agreement will only be achieved on the basis of mutually agreed changes that reflect these realities.

Your analysis is mistaken. Obama also is not saying that they must go back to the armistice lines of 1949. But note, President Bush (II) still references UNSC resolution 242 which refers to the 1967 borders. No difference from what Obama essentially said in his speech. I'm not sure why Netanyahu has gone out of his way to alienate this administration but he has.

He can't even threaten to cut them off. He needs the Jews more than they need him and they know it.

Jews or Israel? They are very different. And for what?

I'm team Israel, because I hate terrorists and cab drivers.

oe

I see no difference

When is the US government going to stop trying to lord over the rest of the world?

For the president to think he has the right to tell other countries what to do shows how incredibly arrogant the people running this country are. We can't even run our country in a reasonable way, what makes us think we have the right to demand anything from others.

It's so brave of Obama to put those selfish Jew Bastards in their place. Who are those dirty Jews anyway? And why are they clinging to that pitiable little piece of earth? Why don't they just go back to Germany? Or Poland? The Germans will take anyone in won't they?

Can't they see that 22 Arab nations is one to few? And that one Jewish Nation is one to many? Can't they understand that tolerating their existence is more than the Arabs can be expected to bear?

Red Bird wrote:When is the US government going to stop trying to lord over the rest of the world?

For the president to think he has the right to tell other countries what to do shows how incredibly arrogant the people running this country are. We can't even run our country in a reasonable way, what makes us think we have the right to demand anything from others.

Need to spread democracy and freedom to the unwashed masses while we rape their lands of resources to feed American gluttony.

Embrace it.

It's a beautiful thing.

Erotic, almost.

oe

If Obama wants to correct the inequities of this world, instead of demanding the Jews give half of Judea to the Arabs, why doesn't he demand that the wealthy elite in this country give some small portion of this nations wealth to the poor?

Yea, I'm talking American Refugees living in poverty in Ohio and California. According to recent data,in our oh so fair minded nation, the richest 3 percent of Americans hold 78 percent of the total wealth, the next 5 percent control the majority of the remaining 22 percent with about 50 percent of Americans holding ZERO percent of the wealth. That's right people, 150 million Americans don't share any of this nations bounty. They have zero percent of land or stocks or anything except loan payments.

Too bad they're not Arabs I guess.

Red Bird wrote:It's so brave of Obama to put those selfish Jew Bastards in their place. Who are those dirty Jews anyway? And why are they clinging to that pitiable little piece of earth? Why don't they just go back to Germany? Or Poland? The Germans will take anyone in won't they?

Can't they see that 22 Arab nations is one to few? And that one Jewish Nation is one to many? Can't they understand that tolerating their existence is more than the Arabs can be expected to bear?

Bwahahahahaha. Nice Rant. You essentially pulled a Rush. Took something minor and exponentially escalated it to something totally unrelated. You're like a crazy football fan with a 30 point lead with 20 seconds left in the game fretting when the opposing team kicks a field goal.

The Jews make money and dnt liked to get fucked with by their neighbors. I can respect that. The Arab Muslim culture is backwards and chaotic. They are a fairly barbaric people, all said and told. Be-headings? Stonings? Acid attacks? Come the fuck on.

Team Jews.

oe

Bwahahahahaha. Nice Rant. You essentially pulled a Rush. Took something minor and exponentially escalated it to something totally unrelated. You're like a crazy football fan with a 30 point lead with 20 seconds left in the game fretting when the opposing team kicks a field goal.

The survival of Israel is hardly unrelated to Obama's treachery.

And you're way out in space if you imagine that Israel is safe. Frankly, I do not expect Israel to survive long term. It is a tiny country surrounded by implacable enemies who have attacked Israel many times in the past. These people teach their children to hate Israel and Jews, so I don't expect them to change.

Technological changes will gradually increase Israel's vulnerability to rocket attacks and perhaps even Nuclear attack.

Arabs living inside Israel are multiplying much faster than the Jews are, so the dirty Jews will eventually be a minority in their own country.

As the power of the US wanes in the 21st century, it will be increasingly difficult for the US to remain an ally of an Isolated Country with such numerous enemies.



Essentially, you've pulled a Rush of your own by going personal and slinging insults after your argument is shown to be complete shit. You're like a loser who is also a poor sport - If you can't win at least you can try to smear your opponent.

Nice choice of mud though.

Technological changes will gradually increase Israel's vulnerability to rocket attacks and perhaps even Nuclear attack.

And putting up settlements 50 miles on the other side of Jeruselum is going to stop a nuclear attack?? NONSENSE.

Red Bird wrote: The survival of Israel is hardly unrelated to Obama's treachery.

What bullshit. What treachery?? It's already been pointed out to you that he didn't say anything different than the policy of this country for the past 30 plus years. You tried to say it was different but the evidence was given to you. So where's the treachery? It was good rant on your part. Just not based upon any facts.

Just admit that you didn't like Obama when he was elected, and you are using this to attack him now. If you can't be honest with everyone here, be honest with yourself.

I did get a kick out of the word treachery. Made the rant so...Shakespearean.