The Goat Pen

Oh my god! Hang that bastard!

Whatever happens to him will not be because of his two prior accusations of criminal misconduct or violence (I think the other item was an O of P against him by an ex girlfriend after an incident).

He looks kinda mexican-y. He mustve done it.

More Stand Your Ground problems...

http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/dpp/news/cr ... n-4-4-2012

Its April 15. His next court date is May 29. His trial (if) will likely be in 2013. Lets just see what developes and hold the door open for whoever is behind you.

I don't even see lazy police work. I see a story from Zimmerman with evidence that corroborates it at the time - which wasn't initially provided to the general public when the story went national. Heck, we saw NBC intentionally editing the 911 call to provide motive for Zimmerman. What I see now is a lynch mob mentality being assuaged by an elected official who only sees upside for herself in handing Zimmerman over to them.

I fully understand the rationale that says there has to be a trial but not under the current circumstances. There isn't going to be justice for Martin by attempting to railroad Zimmerman by overcharging him and either getting a plea or having the case thrown out.

eCat, how can you say that the evidence corroborates it at the time when you don't know what the evidence is? Zimmerman's brother said that Zimmerman lost track of Martin after the 911 call (brother on Piers Morgan). Zimmerman's father said that Martin jumped Zimmerman after Zimmerman had turned after Zimmerman had initially confronted him. Zimmerman's friend said that this never would have happened if Martin had just told Zimmerman he was there to see his father's girlfriend and where. Zimmerman said he was the one screaming for help but other experts say that it was a child's voice. And this is ignoring one witness who was told by the lead investigator that he thought Zimmerman was lying.

Here are the only real facts as we know them, an 17 year old kid with skittles and ice tea in a location that he was supposed to be was followed by a man and shot 3 to 4 minutes after the man was told to stay away by a 911 operator and only one minute or so before the police arrived. I am hard-pressed to see any evidence that could be thoroughly decided upon in 2 hours that says that a decision could be made by the police (who's job it is to invetigate and arrest based on probably cause while it's the job of the prosecutor to determine if a trial should happen).

the police report says Zimmerman had a bloody nose and blood on the back on his head, he also had grass stains and a wet back (heh...wetback) - to me that is clearly signs of a struggle, on top of a witness coming forth and saying he saw them struggling as well.

so we have physical evidence that shows a struggle detailed in the police report. Now unless Zimmerman was in the state of mind after shooting a boy to go punch himself in the nose, pound his head on pavement and then roll around in the grass while people are watching him and calling 911, I think that pretty much sets the table for self defense.

Bklyn wrote:Yep, that's the secondary tragedy of this. That Black Panther shit is kinda lame, though. It's probably about 60 of them, in totality. I think Auburn has more football players under scholarship.

lol

It looks like a big sex scandal to me. You've got the Attourney General giving Al Sharpton a blowjob, the DA getting it off with a dildo and the so called victim may be an illigitimate son ot the Prez (according to him) all trying to butt-fuck some Mexican white guy.

Weird. I just saw chickens

Now unless Zimmerman was in the state of mind after shooting a boy to go punch himself in the nose, pound his head on pavement and then roll around in the grass while people are watching him and calling 911,

That's just not true and even if that is true (and it's all that Zimmerman claimed, the police don't go by the word of someone that is self-interested saying I had to do it. As the law goes, if you start a fight, you don't get to use Stand Your Ground if you are now losing it. That means, they should have treated him as a person who is potentially lying. Any evidence of stains on Martin? How about blood splatter on Zimmerman, if he was supposedly on the ground upside down just before passing out (his brother again). How about entry wound angle? How about the fact that a 17 year old boy is killed in a spot where he was supposed to be while carrying a bag of skittles and an ice tea. It wasn't on Zimmerman's property? Zimmerman could have been rolling in the grass with his pet rabbit that afternoon for all we know.

To say, 'well Zimmerman said it was self-defense', that's good enough for me. What reason does he have to exaggerate? You take him downtown and you grill him for 2 to 3 hours. You take every bit of clothing he has on. You take every picture of him you can, before he gets cleaned up by the paramedics. You cordon off the area, and don't let anybody in the area for the next few days while you are trying to gather every piece of evidence, including looking in his car. And yes, you arrest his ass. While some of this may have been done, it sure doesn't look like all of it was.

Because as it was said by John T. Chance "John Wayne"

Joe Burdette: It wasn't murder.
Nathan Burdette: If he says it wasn't murder, why do you say it was?
John T. Chance: Man gets shot that's got a gun, there's room for reasonable doubt. Man gets shot that hasn't got a gun, what would you call it? But, you knew that already otherwise you wouldn't have set things up the way you did.

Owlmam, your theory is not adding up. Don't let the media drive you.

Spent an hour reading about this subject. No one knows what happened besides Zimmerman & the ones who say they saw it. Let's let the facts play out in court instead of the media. Please?

Jungle Rat wrote:Spent an hour reading about this subject. No one knows what happened besides Zimmerman & the ones who say they saw it. Let's let the facts play out in court

How about that? That is exactly what the parents were asking for.

Owlmam, your theory is not adding up. Don't let the media drive you.

What do you mean? What theory is that? I believe the only theory I put forward was that I thought the prosecutor may have overcharged and that an unarmed 17 year old kid was shot in a place that he was allowed to be.

All I have to go by is the police report, and unless there is evidence that the police report is fabricated to protect Zimmerman then I see a clear case of self defense.

U read the police report? Ok, then. I didn't know it has been released yet.

Deep breaths

it's not surprising ecat is siding with the overzealous neighborhood watch guy given his own history of problems with neighborhood miscreants. if only Zimmerman had taken the path of ecat and dug out a tiger pit, Martin might still be alive today. crippled or maimed but still alive....

I didn't side with him at first. I do believe he was a cop wannabe and he had no business carrying a gun. I also think the police saw the guy as a nuisance given he had called 911 frequently as a neighborhood watch guy.

I think you can say at best this is a nightmare scenario for the prosecutor because even if you have probable cause, you have clearly established reasonable doubt before the trial ever starts. Certainly I am no expert but my understanding is if there is a high probability of reasonable doubt, which the prosecution appears to even subtly hint at, then they typically do not take it to trial.

If that is true, then it goes back to my assertion that this is in an effort to appease the public and media and not an attempt to serve justice.

One final note, this happened in a gated community, not an area where "snitches end up in stitches". While it is easy to say that the Sanford police did not do their due diligence in investigating this event, it is reasonable to assume there would no shortage of witnesses and evidence to come forward immediately after the crime. Nor did you have the suspect/victim attempt to flee. Everything that could be found out about this case was there to be had by the time the detectives arrived on scene.

I would be interested in knowing if the Martin family was aware there was an active neighborhood watch program in their community.

It wasn't the Martin's community. Sanford is near Tampa and Trayvon lived in Miami. The community (which was created at the height of the RE boom...then cratered after the 2008 crash) is largely renters now and has tremendous turnover. It is a well-integrated community, however. Trayvon's father's girlfriend lived there and Trayvon was visiting.

Either way, the neighborhood watch had a policy against carrying weapons. So, if Zimm was officially on watch that, then he was in breach by carrying a weapon. I don't know if that will play into the erosion of his defense or if it has any bearing on the SYG law, but it has been alluded that that fact will be problematic for Zimm.