how unified were we under Obama?
Trump got elected because of Obama's division of this country
I'd say Bush was a great unifier. We were all tired of his ass by the end.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:18 pm
by hedge
"Trump got elected because of Obama's division of this country"
That's absurd...
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:37 pm
by bluetick
hedge wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:18 pm
"Trump got elected because of Obama's division of this country"
That's absurd...
I have to agree. Blacky McBlacky was too much for 40-50% of the country to take. We are racially divided, if not outright racist.
Trump came to politics as the guy who sent lawyers to Hawaii determined to show Obama was an illegitimate president. Almost half the country at one time thought that was the case (25% still do).
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:38 pm
by eCat
hedge wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:18 pm
"Trump got elected because of Obama's division of this country"
That's absurd...
I bet I could pinpoint the day it started
"Trayvon Martin could be my son"
We couldn't even have a conversation about it on here. We lost Spacer shortly after that. He was around but it was limited. I think he could see the writing on the wall.
You can't convince me that had Obama had not been elected, Trump would have ever had a shot at the presidency.
But it wasn't as racial as Bluetick thinks
his rise is direct correlation to being the repudiation of the Obama policies - healthcare, immigration, foreign policy (which Obama basically just extended Bush policies after running on a platform saying he'd do otherwise) and global economy/climate change, unisex bathrooms.....there was no shortage of hot button topics that Obama either introduced or highlighted as president.
and conservative voters had little faith that anyone - Jeb Bush said he was a mexican for crying out loud, that an established republican would fight to change any of it
The racial aspect of it really came into focus as a result of all the African Americans/Worthless Antifa fucks that were pissed off that white America had the nerve to vote for a repudiation of Obama. That's when we lost Brooklyn.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:05 pm
by crotch
Nothing can be more true....especially on this thread
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:14 pm
by eCat
Lets also keep in mind that Obama was a single term Senator from corrupt Chicago who was running as a dove against Hillary the Hawk in a time when Americans wanted out of Afghanistan and Iraq. The country was in financial ruin due to the housing bubble and people were in serious financial difficulty. He was the first and maybe only voice to talk about getting out of wars - and it played well with America seeing Americans die from IEDs and we kill one Al-Qaeda and a more vicious guy pops up to replace him. Water boarding, Gitmo, the Patriot Act - Obama was touching the nerve of Americans who were concerned we were becoming as bad as the people we were fighting
There was no way the country was going to elect the party of the incumbent. So a guy with a Muslim sounding name got elected over a white wasp war hero where under normal circumstances Obama wouldn't have made it out of the primaries.
But he was well spoken, calm and offered a message of hope when America couldn't stomach more of the same from McCain or Hillary. Then he trashed middle America's health care and talked about elections having consequences. Trayvon Martin, Ferguson and the emergence of BLM were the most easily visible division points, but you guys have heard me ranting about Obama ruining my health care since it started. I was not alone by a long shot. The division with Obama didn't start or end with race but clearly race played a role.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:41 pm
by Jungle Rat
Trump is a pussy
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 3:36 pm
by hedge
Do you think Trump and his... well, I can't even say policies, the guy doesn't have policies, he has tweets... do you think that Obama caused more division in American than Trump has? I've never seen the country more divided, and Trump does everything in his power to promote it, or at the very least, stoke up his base at the expense everyone else, which in turn of course makes those who are against him even more rabid in their hatred of him. For instance, he didn't say one word about the other night at his "rally" about George Floyd or the nationwide protests going on in response. In fact the only thing he's ever said about it is stuff like "when the looting starts, the shooting starts." And look, I get it, law and order is a valid aspect for any president to put out there, but seriously, not one word on why so many people are so angry, not one word of empathy or understanding of where they might be coming from? But it's understandable, b/c one thing Trump doesn't have is empathy, and without that, you're can't be a unifier...
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 3:49 pm
by eCat
no, Trump has divided more than Obama
And that division isn't going anywhere anytime soon as long at we have BLM led protests that end up with death, rioting and destruction.
I, and I think I can speak for a good % of flyover states suburban Americans when I say, there is little interest in unifying with people who think that is an appropriate response to an issue. You guys can laugh at Tucker Carlson all you want but he is the most watched cable news show since he started speaking out against the riots.
Don't think there isn't a huge number of people out there that vehemently disagree with much of what you have been supporting.
with Trump's election and the reaction afterward , I think it was pretty clear at that point that unification was not an interest of either side.
The election is going to be about are people tired of Trumps bullshit or are they tired of BLM/Antifa anarchy. And keeping Biden off the camera, where he'll remind alot of people he's more Hillary than he is progressive is a good strategy. 3 months ago it was his response to Covid 19. 6 months ago is was the robust economy
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 4:00 pm
by Jungle Rat
BLM protests resulting in death, rioting and destruction. WTF? You obviously are clueless. Have you even been to a protest this last month? I'm guessing no. Just hid in your Milford bunker with all your weapons waiting for the niggers to come. E, you are so far behind.
I'm not sure that Barack Obama himself is the cause of the racial division that dominates the political sphere now, but I do know that it definitely started ramping up while Obama was President and not under Trump. Prior to I think the BART shooting in 2009 after Obama was elected, which I am pretty sure we discussed at worldcrossing, we had kinda gone almost 20 years with race on the media back burner (except maybe regarding illegal immigration). A period that culminated with the country electing a black President in 2008. The only thing I can think of between the LA riots that was covered a lot were I think riots in Cincinnati before 9/11.
Then suddenly it really blew up during Obama's Presidency and there was one hit after another and has not stopped since. The BART thing, Trayvon Martin, Ferguson, Freddie Gray, the University of Missouri stuff, I think there was one I can recall in Milwaukee and a few other incidents of civil unrest. Then another Presidential election that basically was made out to be (and still is) as racists vs non-racists as if that boiled it all down.
Personally, I do think Trayvon Martin flipped the switch on the media coverage and in many people's minds, and had an influence on the marxist leaning elements to add racial inequality back into the bag of tricks in 2012. Prior to that we had the Occupy Wall Street thing in 2011, and if you go back and remember and read about that now, and think about the kind of racial undertones such an event would definitely have now when you think from today's perspective (like this CHAZ/CHOP thing in Seattle)...its actually kind of surprising that racial inequality wasn't really at all addressed back then, it was just kind of given that the 99% were of all races.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 4:50 pm
by aTm
TLDR version...Trump can hardly be called the cause of the current divisive nature of racial politics. If anything he is a symptom of it. His Presidency was created by it, not the other way around.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 4:52 pm
by eCat
aTm wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2020 4:50 pm
TLDR version...Trump can hardly be called the cause of the current divisive nature of racial politics. If anything he is a symptom of it. His Presidency was created by it, not the other way around.
I agree
He would have never been elected without us living thru the Obama presidency.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:38 pm
by hedge
"Don't think there isn't a huge number of people out there that vehemently disagree with much of what you have been supporting."
I really don't think anybody is supporting riots, looting or lawlessness in general. If all you watch is Fox News, you'd think that's the only thing happening out there, but it's not. Just looking at the numbers of people at these protests all over the country, if the majority of them were looting/burning/etc, we wouldn't even have a country left. The truth is, everybody loves the sensational, which is one reason they show the looting and burning over and over and over again. I feel confident that the vast majority of people aren't doing that, they are simply out in public peacefully protesting. Yeah, there might be some screaming and yelling and rude language, but that's not illegal. And I feel pretty sure that many aren't even doing that.
Rat has given eyewitness account of what he's seen, maybe you think he's lying but I don't. My county is 40% black, there were a couple of windows broken downtown and that's it. Have not heard of much down here in eastern NC more than that (again, 40% (at least) black population down here). There was one night in Raleigh where some storefronts got busted out, not sure if anything was stolen (probably was) but considering the numbers of people out in the streets, I'd say it was minimal. Doesn't mean I support that kind of activity, I don't, and I kinda resent being told that I do. Now then, the police-free "safe" zone in Seattle, that's a step too far for me. Those are public streets, no group of people just gets to claim them for themselves and try to enforce rules that they made up.
So again, I don't "support" what you seem to think I do. Yeah, I know you can point out numerous examples of crime and destruction, I've seen them myself, but again, given the size of the crowds that have been out and the length of time all this has been going on, I'd say it's minimal. Not condoning it, but in the big picture, there's been a lot more peaceful protest than wanton destruction. And as I've also said, I'm sure much if not most of it has been caused by radical actors from all sides of the spectrum who don't really give a shit about police reform or equality or anything else except mischief for mischief's sake, which again, I don't "support"...
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:47 pm
by hedge
"Prior to that we had the Occupy Wall Street thing in 2011"
39 second mark, green shirt, blue flag:
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:52 pm
by eCat
sigh...........
A rope found in the garage stall of Black driver Bubba Wallace at the NASCAR race Sunday was a garage door pull, not a noose, and had been there since 2019, federal authorities and NASCAR said Tuesday.
Northern District of Alabama U.S. Attorney Jay Town on Monday announced his office had launched an investigation along with the FBI and the Department of Justice Civil Rights Division. Town said they were looking to see whether there are violations of federal law. No federal crime was committed, his office said.
Town and FBI Special Agent in Charge Johnnie Sharp Jr. on Tuesday released this statement about the probe: “On Monday, fifteen FBI special agents conducted numerous interviews regarding the situation at Talladega Superspeedway. After a thorough review of the facts and evidence surrounding this event, we have concluded that no federal crime was committed.
The FBI learned that garage number 4, where the noose was found, was assigned to Bubba Wallace last week. The investigation also revealed evidence, including authentic video confirmed by NASCAR, that the noose found in garage number 4 was in that garage as early as October 2019. Although the noose is now known to have been in garage number 4 in 2019, nobody could have known Mr. Wallace would be assigned to garage number 4 last week.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:56 pm
by Jungle Rat
It's Obamas fault!
Idiot
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:04 pm
by eCat
hedge wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:38 pm
"Don't think there isn't a huge number of people out there that vehemently disagree with much of what you have been supporting."
I really don't think anybody is supporting riots, looting or lawlessness in general. If all you watch is Fox News, you'd think that's the only thing happening out there, but it's not. Just looking at the numbers of people at these protests all over the country, if the majority of them were looting/burning/etc, we wouldn't even have a country left. The truth is, everybody loves the sensational, which is one reason they show the looting and burning over and over and over again. I feel confident that the vast majority of people aren't doing that, they are simply out in public peacefully protesting. Yeah, there might be some screaming and yelling and rude language, but that's not illegal. And I feel pretty sure that many aren't even doing that.
Rat has given eyewitness account of what he's seen, maybe you think he's lying but I don't. My county is 40% black, there were a couple of windows broken downtown and that's it. Have not heard of much down here in eastern NC more than that (again, 40% (at least) black population down here). There was one night in Raleigh where some storefronts got busted out, not sure if anything was stolen (probably was) but considering the numbers of people out in the streets, I'd say it was minimal. Doesn't mean I support that kind of activity, I don't, and I kinda resent being told that I do. Now then, the police-free "safe" zone in Seattle, that's a step too far for me. Those are public streets, no group of people just gets to claim them for themselves and try to enforce rules that they made up.
So again, I don't "support" what you seem to think I do. Yeah, I know you can point out numerous examples of crime and destruction, I've seen them myself, but again, given the size of the crowds that have been out and the length of time all this has been going on, I'd say it's minimal. Not condoning it, but in the big picture, there's been a lot more peaceful protest than wanton destruction. And as I've also said, I'm sure much if not most of it has been caused by radical actors from all sides of the spectrum who don't really give a shit about police reform or equality or anything else except mischief for mischief's sake, which again, I don't "support"...
you know what, no one cares what you resent or don't.
this is the world we live in
I'd like to protest BLM or attend a Trump rally without being called a racist, but I'm not afforded that.
When you attend a rally and a guy runs over someone in the crowd, you're a neo nazi.
When you protest and a riot breaks out, then guess what, you're not a protester, you're a rioter. Your activities were the catalyst for a riot, just like the people who attended the protest in Charlotte are responsible for a white supremacist driving his car into the crowd.
People ridiculed Trump for saying there were good people on both sides when clearly every single one of them were white supremacists.
If you're standing next to the guy throwing a molotov cocktail you're implicitly supporting his actions by being there.
Yea, there are good people there that go to protests just like there are good people that go to support Trump, but the left supporters aren't going to drive that narrative and the right is going to do the same.
Here is what I do know - if the protest didn't happen the rioting wouldn't happen. By continuing to protest, knowing the likelihood of riot, and those people stealing $20 worth of toilet paper as you put it (but you aren't supporting them mind you.....), are being given tacit approval of their actions by the protestors , and because chicken shit political leaders are scared to put it down when it starts out of fear or being seen as unsympathetic to the BLM cause, its led to the shit in Seattle and because Seattle didn't put it down, we can expect this to escalate in another city. Now Antifa and BLM believe its their right to take over city blocks for their cause, all because a cop didn't stop some mouthy shithead picking up a rock with a baton to the head a month ago.
Re: Florida State Seminoles
Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:05 pm
by hedge
"A rope found in the garage stall of Black driver Bubba Wallace at the NASCAR race Sunday was a garage door pull, not a noose... Although the noose is now known to have been in garage number 4 in 2019, nobody could have known Mr. Wallace would be assigned to garage number 4 last week."
So was it a noose that was being used as a garage door pull? Irregardless, I'm glad that it clearly wasn't anything like what it originally seemed to be (and what NASCAR evidently felt it was) and I'm not going to sit here and say "well, even if it was being used as a garage door pull, it's inappropriate for that to be hanging anywhere for any reason, blahblahblah," b/c it's not, but I still would like to know if it was an actual noose being used as a garage door pull...