Florida State Seminoles

[hedge]

"Nicholson went to jail

for Trump , this will galvanize his base"

That's perfectly in keeping with the whole jury nullification nature of Trump's presidency so far. The inmates have taken over the asylum, and I suspect a good number of them would not only not disagree with the characterization, but take pride in it. For them, the cult of personality is greater than institutional norms and stability (cue deep state collusion rant). I guess the multiple court cases that Trump is losing (and losing on appeal, and will continue losing on appeal) is just another example of the deep state collusion by the judiciary. They're next in the bulls-eye, I can almost guarantee that. If anything goes to the Supreme Court and Gorsuch and Kavanaugh rule against Trump, they'll be branded as traitors. Traitors to what, I don't know, but they will be definitely be branded as traitors...

[hedge]

"How is that different than telling Mexico no money unless you crack down on drug cartels smuggling into America or India in regards to water pollution?"

I think we're fixin to find out...

[hedge]

"you totally went the wrong way on that one"

Look, by definition if you're impeaching somebody it's b/c you think they did something wrong, so yeah, I guess if you want to call that "moral high ground" then so be it. Look, we've had democratic majority House for most of the 20th century and nobody ever tried to impeach the president. Then the repubs get in the majority for the first time in forever and the first thing they do is impeach Bill Clinton. I'm not saying this is payback for that (I have hinted at that in here before but I wasn't serious), but I am saying dems have been in a position to impeach Reagan, Bush Sr. and a couple of years Dubya, but as far as I can recall, I don't remember any serious movement to do so, even with Iran Contra or anything else. It's just not something that's ever been done just b/c the other side didn't "like" the president.

I know most Trump supporters think that's the whole reason behind this, i.e, that the dems just don't "like" Trump, but that's just stupid. I don't like him either and I think he's a moron, but I felt the same way about Dubya (and to a lesser extent, Reagan), but I never thought they did anything that was impeachable (well, maybe Reagan). Trump supporters either won't admit that the dude is totally off the reservation or else they somehow intrinsically understand that that is exactly what they love about him. Which is fine, but don't be pissed that a lot of other people are not fine with it, and it's not just b/c they don't "like" him. Like I said, that's just stupid...

[bluetick]

Nicholson lied about it for 90% of the movie, erased flight logs, created false documents and intimidated potential witnesses

This isn't so much Trumps arrogance, this is Trumps ignorance. He , liked probably 80% of America, thought it was perfectly OK to tell a country to investigate someone who is doing something wrong there or we aren't going to give you money. How is that different than telling Mexico no money unless you crack down on drug cartels smuggling into America or India in regards to water pollution?

"No military aid until you announce investigations into the son of my main political rival, but more importantly I need your country to take Putin off the hook regarding the 2016 election so I can make a case for dropping sanctions against Russia AGAIN (I have my reasons - so nevermind why)."

Bullshit that he didn't know it was wrong. Bolton told him it was wrong and then hit the door. The conversation went on a classified server so no one could get to it. Barr tried to cover it up. Trump learned all about the evils of election meddling for fuck sake - yet he made that Ukraine call the day after the Mueller case ended.

[aTm]

"Rah rah rah! Red, red, RED!"

"Go Team Blue! BLUE, BLUE BLUE!"

[hedge]

""Rah rah rah! Red, red, RED!"

"aTm! Dead, dead, DEAD!!"

[eCat]

Nicholson lied about it for 90% of the movie, erased flight logs, created false documents and intimidated potential witnesses

This isn't so much Trumps arrogance, this is Trumps ignorance. He , liked probably 80% of America, thought it was perfectly OK to tell a country to investigate someone who is doing something wrong there or we aren't going to give you money. How is that different than telling Mexico no money unless you crack down on drug cartels smuggling into America or India in regards to water pollution?

"No military aid until you announce investigations into the son of my main political rival, but more importantly I need your country to take Putin off the hook regarding the 2016 election so I can make a case for dropping sanctions against Russia AGAIN (I have my reasons - so nevermind why)."

Bullshit that he didn't know it was wrong. Bolton told him it was wrong and then hit the door. The conversation went on a classified server so no one could get to it. Barr tried to cover it up. Trump learned all about the evils of election meddling for fuck sake - yet he made that Ukraine call the day after the Mueller case ended.

Bolton isn't exactly the foundation on which you base good judgement. Trump knew that when we brought the guy in.

[eCat]

"you totally went the wrong way on that one"

Look, by definition if you're impeaching somebody it's b/c you think they did something wrong, so yeah, I guess if you want to call that "moral high ground" then so be it. Look, we've had democratic majority House for most of the 20th century and nobody ever tried to impeach the president. Then the repubs get in the majority for the first time in forever and the first thing they do is impeach Bill Clinton. I'm not saying this is payback for that (I have hinted at that in here before but I wasn't serious), but I am saying dems have been in a position to impeach Reagan, Bush Sr. and a couple of years Dubya, but as far as I can recall, I don't remember any serious movement to do so, even with Iran Contra or anything else. It's just not something that's ever been done just b/c the other side didn't "like" the president.

I know most Trump supporters think that's the whole reason behind this, i.e, that the dems just don't "like" Trump, but that's just stupid. I don't like him either and I think he's a moron, but I felt the same way about Dubya (and to a lesser extent, Reagan), but I never thought they did anything that was impeachable (well, maybe Reagan). Trump supporters either won't admit that the dude is totally off the reservation or else they somehow intrinsically understand that that is exactly what they love about him. Which is fine, but don't be pissed that a lot of other people are not fine with it, and it's not just b/c they don't "like" him. Like I said, that's just stupid...

won't admit he's off the reservation? hell, he got elected because he was off the reservation. They absolutely admit it, they revel in it. Thats why he can do no wrong.

I didn't think I'd need to explain it but the moral high ground isn't the hypocrisy of repubs, its the democrats who again, believe the ends justifies the means.

Do they care that Biden set up his son for millions in Ukrainian slush money? nope, won't even discuss it. Would they be shitting themselves if Trump Jr. was getting that kind of cash? absolutely.

The issue is that democrats and the anti-trumpers hold everyone else but themselves to a higher standard. Yea, you can say that about Trump and his supporters, and its probably true, but then again, they're the ones getting attacked, so the mirror isn't being held up to them.

[sardis]

"No military aid until you announce investigations into the son of my main political rival, but more importantly I need your country to take Putin off the hook regarding the 2016 election so I can make a case for dropping sanctions against Russia AGAIN (I have my reasons - so nevermind why)."

Is that one of those Adam Schiff type quotes?

[Jungle Rat]

I think Trump did tie aid to the investigation and is /should be unapologetic for it

This is a "A Few Good Men" moment where Trump is Nicholson on the stand "You damn right I tied aid to the investigation!"

The outrage should be about Biden's son getting millions of dollars from his fathers influence and his father meddling in an investigation that could implicate his son

but again, no one cares....the end justifies the means.

This cracks me up considering Trumps evil spawn

[hedge]

"won't admit he's off the reservation? hell, he got elected because he was off the reservation. They absolutely admit it, they revel in it. Thats why he can do no wrong."

Keep in mind I am asking this as someone who has held mildly anarchic views most of my life: Do you really think that's a good way to run a country?? Part of me is amused that national politics have been openly and blatantly shown to be the equivalent of professional wrestling, but I guess since I'm basically a middle-aged man now, it's not quite as amusing as I probably would've found it 30 years ago. And I certainly don't think that many Trump supporters feel that way. It's still real to them, damn it!!

[hedge]

Col. Vindman kinda looks like eCat:

[eCat]

"won't admit he's off the reservation? hell, he got elected because he was off the reservation. They absolutely admit it, they revel in it. Thats why he can do no wrong."

Keep in mind I am asking this as someone who has held mildly anarchic views most of my life: Do you really think that's a good way to run a country?? Part of me is amused that national politics have been openly and blatantly shown to be the equivalent of professional wrestling, but I guess since I'm basically a middle-aged man now, it's not quite as amusing as I probably would've found it 30 years ago. And I certainly don't think that many Trump supporters feel that way. It's still real to them, damn it!!

other than the ballooning debt, I don't think Trump is causing any harm - think about how he's changed the way we think about newspapers, TV, Washington D.C., he's pretty much responsible for a wave of nationalism not only in the US but also Europe, he's opened people eyes about mass immigration in multiple countries, he's speaks directly to the people via twitter - and even though he talks like an 8th grader, he's the most effective communicator to the masses in our modern era.

If you want to focus on the bullshit like this Ukraine thing, you're not seeing the bigger picture - Trump has fundamentally changed politics in America, maybe forever. He's forced not only Republicans to change but has pushed Democrats into thinking they have to be extremists in order to equal him in the political domain. You don't hear about the Tea Party - he's marginalized them, he marginalized the up and comers in the party - Ted Cruz, Rand Paul - they all are trying to find daylight living in his shadow and while they despised him 3 years ago, they line up to support him now. Mitt Romney is screaming for someone to listen to him, He wiped out the Clinton dynasty - Think of all the effort and planning Hillary put into the presidency - she had the DNC co-opted to kill any chance of a rival she faced and still lost - and up until that point she was political royalty. Look at all the politicians who stepped down - Paul Ryan was 4 years removed from a V.P. run, Rence Preibus was RNC national chairman - career politicians have decided to cut short their time at the trough because they can't co-exist in a Trump run world.

CNN, Fox and MSNBC , along with Stephen Colbert has essentially dedicated their networks to covering him, a billionaire has bought a newspaper to fight him, the #metoo movement evolved in large part because of backlash against him, a movement of violent protestors with leftist mayors in Antifa looking the other way has sprung up, and he's left a wake of people who thought they could take him on and failed

You may hate him, but Trump has moved the needle more than any politician in our lifetime.

This is a shake out that needed to happen. I was hoping for more of it to be honest but I didn't anticipate the guantlet of D.C. and their never ending obstruction in trying to have a political coup in getting him out - not only politicians but the FBI, CIA and a ton of Obama holdovers.

[eCat]

Col. Vindman kinda looks like eCat:

you guys think I look like every male that is over 40

[hedge]

I appreciate your strong feelings for Trump and what you think he represents, and I'm sure you're not alone, but in my opinion, we'll go back to business as usual the day he's gone (and frankly, it's really business as usual now). He hasn't changed anything, except for maybe destroyed the republican party. People who have been conditioned to the daily professional wrestler routine of shouting down whoever gets called out as the daily patsy are not going to have the attention span or interest in a Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio or any other even semi-normal politician. It's all bread and circuses with Trump. Nobody is going to be able to fill that void, and when this circus tent comes down and rolls out of town, the professional wrestling fans are going to pack up and go home, too. Nothing has changed and in 20 years nobody is going to care or even remember. But I'll give Trump credit for milking the spotlight for all it's worth. At that even I can't deny that Trump is master...

[hedge]

Case in point: Look at the Kentucky governor's race right now. This repub Belvins (or whatever his name is) is fixin to lose to a democrat. Now I understand that a Kentucky democrat isn't the same as a New York or California democrat, but the point is, Blevins isn't Trump. He sassed teachers and so Crotch and Co. won't vote for him, and this is going to be the case with almost all repub candidates in any state or federal race going forward. Bottom line is, they're not Trump and nobody else is ever going to be, ever (yes, that's two "ever's"). It's like trying to replace Ric Flair with Don Kernoodle. Ain't gonna happen....

[aTm]

All Republicans should be shot.

[hedge]

>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[hedge]

"All Republicans should be shot."

Not all, just the ones I don't like...

[hedge]

That's Don Kernoodle, in case anybody was wondering...