The Goat Pen

JD,

JD wrote:• The net worth of the average black household in the United States is $6,314, compared with $110,500 for the average white household, according to 2011 census data.

Of course.

The average black child is 75% likely to be born illegitimate. The white child is 36% likely to be illegitimate. That is the main reason why there is such a huge net worth disparity. This is where pastors in black churches (you know people like JD) need to tell (actually SHAME) all the people in their church "You want to be rich? Don't have kids out of wedlock, don't be a baby-mama! Get and STAY married. And don't ever get divorced because that is sin, its right there in the Bible. Amen!"

There you go. This is all on you JD. Change the culture.

innocentbystander wrote:JD,

JD wrote:• The net worth of the average black household in the United States is $6,314, compared with $110,500 for the average white household, according to 2011 census data.

Of course.

The average black child is 75% likely to be born illegitimate. The white child is 36% likely to be illegitimate. That is the main reason why there is such a huge net worth disparity. This is where pastors in black churches (you know people like JD) need to tell (actually SHAME) all the people in their church "You want to be rich? Don't have kids out of wedlock, don't be a baby-mama! Get and STAY married. And don't ever get divorced because that is sin, its right there in the Bible. Amen!"

There you go. This is all on you JD. Change the culture.

Agree on the marriage-is-a-wealth-building-tool point, and I have "Celebrate Black Marriage Sunday" every March in my church, promoting marriage and offering both my church and my services for free if money is an issue. (Of course, if you're spending $500.00 on the bartender, $1,500.00 on the DJ, $3,500.00 on the dress, etc., then gas money for the pastor shouldn't be an issue).

But marriage isn't the big problem - it's education, which is (still, along with housing) the most segregated sector of American society. I don't have time to go in depth on the issue at 3 a.m. here, but the tools to equality are education, employment and access.

It's not accidental that teaching blacks to read was forbidden by statute for 250 years, then forbidden by actual practice for another 100 years, and is now forbidden by budget for the last 50 years in the former slave states. Housing segregation played a major piece as well, because educational resources go where the white people live. My dad can tell stories about having 8th grade classes with 3rd grade books while all of the new books and materials went to the white schools.

People fought busing because they said they thought that blacks would "bring their schools down," but they never tried building the black schools up when "separate-but-equal" was the law. The issue has so deteriorated over time that we have what many are calling a School-To-Prison pipeline for black males.

I'm a part of http://justicenotjails.org/ - the link is safe - there is a snapshot of the other side of the issue. I'd suggest you google Professor Michelle Alexander (of tOSU) and see why her book is now required reading at dozens of colleges and universities.

I find myself in rare agreement with both IB and JD. I think the culture of fatherlessness is a big factor in economic inequality. Fathers are so important in the formation of a child, and when there is no father, there is a big negative impact. Having two parents in the home is something that can only come from within.

I also agree with JD that lack of educational opportunity is the greatest disservice that the government does to the black community today. Inner city schools are grossly underfunded, often mismanaged, and do not give their minority students much of an education. In places like south side Chicago, kids have the added burden of dodging bullets on their way to and from school, which is not conducive to good study habits. Those poor kids truly have the odds of getting a decent education stacked against them, and that harms their earning potential for the rest of their lives.

I would only point out that the vast majority of American big cities are run by Democrats. Many are run by black democrat mayors , city councils, school superintendents, etc. So if the urban school systems are broken - and they are - then the blame should start with the Democrats that run them.

Does the father need to be male also?

Another point where I agree with JD is America's over-incarceration of its citizens in general, and black males in particular. There are now over 2 million Americans in prison. We incarcerate a higher percentage of our population than any other country by far, including North Korea, Iran, etc. The current system of "mandatory minimum" sentencing takes a lot of discretion away from judges and puts first-time, non-violent drug offenders in prison for ridiculously long periods of time.

Professor Tiger wrote:Another point where I agree with JD is America's over-incarceration of its citizens in general, and black males in particular. There are now over 2 million Americans in prison. We incarcerate a higher percentage of our population than any other country by far, including North Korea, Iran, etc. The current system of "mandatory minimum" sentencing takes a lot of discretion away from judges and puts first-time, non-violent drug offenders in prison for ridiculously long periods of time.

It's also a MASSIVE budget drain and many states - like mine - literally have to choose between schools and prisons. The most powerful union in this state is the Prison Guards, so we continually choose prisons.

JD,

But marriage isn't the big problem - it's education, which is (still, along with housing) the most segregated sector of American society. I don't have time to go in depth on the issue at 3 a.m. here, but the tools to equality are education, employment and access.

Really? That isn't THE big problem for wealth accumulation in black families?

People fought busing because they said they thought that blacks would "bring their schools down," but they never tried building the black schools up when "separate-but-equal" was the law. The issue has so deteriorated over time that we have what many are calling a School-To-Prison pipeline for black males.

You missed a step. It is (first) born illegitimate to school to prison pipeline for black males. Check out the bastardy rate among black prisoners in our prison system and compare that rate to that of any other ethnicity (white, asian, hispanic, anything) and you will see an alarming high percentage of black prisoners were born illegitimate. That is why I keep harping on the marriage point. Getting married BEFORE you have kids and staying married helps keep the young black males out of prison. Let me ammend that statement, getting married BEFORE you have kids and staying married helps keep the young males out of prison (regardless of skin color.) I truly believe that, and I think you do too JD.

The education thing? You are trying to put the cart before the horse. I was one of the first people in my family to get a bachelor's degree and the grandparents (on both sides) I am amazed they made it through high school. There was not a lot of education there (almost none) but there was marriage first, then kids, no divorces, no prison sentences, and there WAS (in the absence of education) some wealth building.

Toemeesleather wrote:Does the father need to be male also?

Yes. Critical.

Dad works (two jobs if he must.) Dad is the head of the house, tells everyone what to do. Mom listens to dad, does whatever he says. Kids listen to mom, does whatever she says. Kids stay out of trouble and stay out of jail. Parents stay married. No violence. No police. No illegitimacy. No poverty or ruin. They may not get rich, but (with patience) they will build some wealth and some hope for the future.

"The education thing? You are trying to put the cart before the horse."

"I think, therefore I exist." Isn't that putting Descartes before the horse?

"They may not get rich, but (with patience) they will build some wealth and some hope for the future."

It is difficult for me to imagine any scenario where your children could have hope for the future. Besides your death, I mean...

hedge wrote:"They may not get rich, but (with patience) they will build some wealth and some hope for the future."

It is difficult for me to imagine any scenario where your children could have hope for the future. Besides your death, I mean...

It is difficult for me to imagine any scenario where you can actually think about anything (let alone imagine it.)

Johnette's Daddy wrote: It's also a MASSIVE budget drain and many states - like mine - literally have to choose between schools and prisons. The most powerful union in this state is the Prison Guards, so we continually choose prisons.

In addition to the questionable morality of draconian sentences for first-time, non-violent drug offenders, you are correct: prisons are expensive. The feds budget around $25k per inmate. In places like Alabama and Mississippi, that's a starting teacher's annual salary.

I'm surprised that the correctional officers' union is so powerful in CA. In most places, it's the teachers' union that calls the shots. That's definitely the case in one place I lived near - Chicago.

Maybe the problem of funding for Chicago schools is not too little on the top line, but getting lost before it hits the bottom line.

http://chicagoist.com/2013/06/19/crains ... how_to.php

Professor Tiger wrote:Arctic ice cap thicker than ever:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... E-now.html

Yeah, not so much. 2012 had the lowest minimum ever so, while there is more ice there now than there was at the lowest point ever, it's still way below the average and approaching 2 standard deviations from the average - http://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/charc ... ice-graph/

The trend line is steeply sloping down and any reports that there is more ice that ever are nonsense - http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/

And, in other wonderful news, land ice in both the north and south (Greenland and Antarctica) is shrinking rapidly. 450 billion tons of ice is lost every year into the oceans - http://www.the-cryosphere.net/8/1539/20 ... -2014.html

Why did you lie, Prof?

sardis wrote:Maybe the problem of funding for Chicago schools is not too little on the top line, but getting lost before it hits the bottom line.

http://chicagoist.com/2013/06/19/crains ... how_to.php

That would be business as usual for Chicago. I love that town, but it is probably the most corrupt city in the most corrupt state in the US.

Haven't seen a Ukraine update here lately. I hope DSL is ok.

I hope ISIS kidnaps IB next.

Jungle Rat wrote:I hope ISIS kidnaps IB next.

I'd blog from the prison camp right up until they cut off my head