The Goat Pen

hedge wrote:No fair-minded reader of these forums would ever mistake me for a champion of the status quo...

There are no fair-minded readers of these forums.

My sole, interesting-only-to-me comment on the topic:

I once had an office in a house on "Sugar Hill" in Los Angeles. The building is owned by the church where I started my ministry and served as youth pastor 20+ years ago. It is also the former home of Hattie McDaniel, the first African American to win an Oscar (for her role as "Mammy" in GWTW).

The neighborhood was being integrated by well-to-do blacks in the 40s, but because of restrictive covenants (neighborhood didn't allow non-Caucasians), McDaniel (and other black Hollywood types like Bill "Bojangles" Robinson) had a years-long court battle, which they eventually won.

Hattie bought the house in 1938 for $15K (17 rooms, 4 bedrooms, full basement, Olympic sized pool, caretakers cottage in the back). The church bought it for $45K in the 1970s. The church had to restore the house in the early 90s to Historical Register standards - at a cost north of $800K.

AlabamAlum wrote:The best movie reviewer of all time on GWTW:


http://www.theatlantic.com/past/docs/is ... /kauff.htm

Kauffmann's infamous review of The Godfather. http://www.newrepublic.com/article/film ... ril-1-1972

The critic had a falling out with Brando and he panned everything the actor was associated with after On the Waterfront (including Apocalypse Now and The Missouri Breaks for crissakes). Kauffman similarly ripped anything associated with Jack Nicholson (even as late as The Departed). The guy could harbor a serious grudge.

Meanwhile, he thought Stacy Keach was the quintessential American film actor.

Al Pacino, as Brando's heir, rattles around in a part too demanding for him. James Caan is OK as his older brother. The surprisingly rotten score by Nino Rota contains a quotation from "Manhattan Serenade" as a plane lands in Los Angeles. Francis Ford Coppola, the director and co-adapter (with Mario Puzo), has saved all his limited ingenuity for the shootings and stranglings, which are among the most vicious I can remember on film. The print of the picture showed to the New York press had very washed-out colors.

Heh. So after ripping Brando ad nauseum, this was his closing paragraph: Pacino was in over his head, meh to James Caan, and the youthful Coppola possesed "limited ingenuity."

"Kauffman similarly ripped anything associated with Jack Nicholson (even as late as The Departed)."

Good lord, how old was Kauffmann when The Departed came out? 110??

Tony Gwynn dead at 54...Christ.

Gone with the wind...

AlabamAlum wrote:Tony Gwynn dead at 54...Christ.

I never really appreciated Gwynn until after the '94 strike. Before that, I thought he was a good LH hitter, but not up there with Mattingly, Boggs or aging guys like Parker and Carew. I'd routinely take guys like Kirk Gibson or Darryl Strawberry over him in drafts because I greatly valued power. But after the strike, the two guys who drew me back into baseball were Gwynn and Griffey, Jr. Gwynn put up some amazing numbers at 34-35-36 and you could tell he wasn't juicing. Ditto Griffey, who would've hit 80-90 homers if he would have juiced. Neither had Adonis like physiques, but both played the game the right way and maximized their abilities.

One of my buddies claims to have played HS basketball with Gwynn and says he had NBA level skills, as well.

Gwynn has the highest BA of any MLB player since Red Williams. Awesome talent, and a really nice person.

Who the blue hell is Red Williams?

Gwynn also does a great Ricky Henderson impression and has some great stories he told to Jim Rome on his radio show.

Red is Ted. Typing on my phone.

Any kin to Red Butler?

We're Last Again! U.S. Health Care Ranks Poorly - NBC News

http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-ca ... ly-n132081

The embarrassing reports have been an impetus for health reform in the U.S. including the 2010 Affordable Care Act. Before the issue became a divisive political debate, both Republicans and Democrats agreed on the need for health reform.

Some politicians have held up other countries' health systems as examples of what they don't want for the U.S., but the report finds countries with nationalized medical systems outperform the U.S. on all measures. "On indicators of efficiency, the U.S. ranks last among the 11 countries

Another new low achieved in DC....with a twist, this one's laughable.


The IRS asserts that it has "determined that Ms. Lerner's computer crashed in mid-2011. . . . The data stored on her computer's hard drive was determined to be 'unrecoverable' by the IT [information technology] professionals." The agency further claims to have "confirmed that back-up tapes from 2011 no longer exist because they have been recycled."


The race to the bottom continues.

And you'll be there waiting...

The only thing I learned from Margaret Mitchell is to look both ways before crossing the street.

I completely agree w/ AA that GWTW and Faulkner are horribly overrated. Just turrible.

However, I will brook no sass when it comes to Three's Company.........

hedge wrote:"Aside from race there's a scene where Rhett basically rapes Scarlett. Okay, fine. I don't object to that being in a movie. But the next morning she is positively glowing with a smile of total contentment on her face."

I saw a documentary on Vivian Leigh, they all but said she was a nymphomaniac. Evidently slept with tons of men. Of course, that has nothing to do with the scene you mention (which is one of my favorites - showing that what Scartlett really needed was just a good grudge fucking. And it worked...), but I did find if kinda interesting. I guess I am confused as to what you find to be a "realistic" rendering of romantic love. Obviously, it can't be anything that appeals to the prurient interest of the audience, which clearly upsets your chaste sensibilities. Ozzy and Harriett? The Brady Bunch? I suspect you're a big fan of Jennifer Anniston movies...

I am far from being a prude and I'm not objecting to this content being in the movie. I am saying that using marital rape as 'comic relief' (and this is what the morning after shows us it was) dates the movie. I can't imagine that scene being given the same treatment today. Scarlett wouldn't be all giggles and sunshine the next morning. Whatever barbarity or brutishness of Rhett's they were trying to convey is completely undercut by the very next scene. And it's not the actors' fault either; it's the script.

Toemeesleather wrote:Another new low achieved in DC....with a twist, this one's laughable.


The IRS asserts that it has "determined that Ms. Lerner's computer crashed in mid-2011. . . . The data stored on her computer's hard drive was determined to be 'unrecoverable' by the IT [information technology] professionals." The agency further claims to have "confirmed that back-up tapes from 2011 no longer exist because they have been recycled."


The race to the bottom continues.

Nixon would be proud. Question to the Obama supporters around here: Do any of you REALLY think that Lois Lerner's emails were "accidentally" lost?

This would be my response. Call everybody involved with the "disappearance" of Lois Lerner's emails before a court of law. Put them under oath. Ask them if they, personally, had anything to do with the disappearance of those emails. Tell them that, if they are caught lying, they will go to prison. Show them an orange jumpsuit in their size, just to get the point across. If they deny any involvement, fine.

Then, the R's should wait until they control the Senate and the House next fall. Use that power to hire a truly INDEPENDENT IT corporation to go through every single line of code. They should find out where, when, and by whom, the missing emails "accidentally" went missing. Then prosecute them to the full extent of the law. Orange is the new black.

hedge wrote:"The love triangle is mostly on a level with dimestore trash romance novels."

I'm hard-pressed to think of a love triangle that isn't mostly on that same level. How is the love triangle in Casablanca any different? B/c Ingrid Bergman was sacrificing her love for Bogart to something "higher" (war effort)? Give me a break. Love triangles are essentially ridiculous. Hell, romantic love in any form is essentially ridiculous. But it's all we've got. Well, that and it's flip side, i.e., hatred, murder and war. I don't fault anyone for being more interested in the latter, but that's no reason to fault a love story for being essentially ridiculous...

I find the triangle in Casablance quite a bit more believable and worthwhile than GWTW. The characters are completely static for 20 years and then all do 180 degree turns at the exact same time in the movie (Melanie's death). Scarlet suddenlyrealizes she's been chasing an Ashley that doesn't exist. Ashley mutters something unintelligible about love and Melanie. And Rhett decides that after 20 years of trying to force Scarlett to love him he's going to give up now, on Melanie's deathbed.

It's been a while since I've seen Casablanca too but I don't remember it being the canned corn that this movie is. And if you don't believe in Ingrid Bergman's sacrifice, at least there was some higher struggle in her trying to decide between the two men. What internal struggle does Scareltt have other than trying to decide who she wants to fuck more? Casablanca, made in wartime, urges sacrifice. GWTW encourages the viewer, by contrast, to indulge in nostalgia and spectacle. Both were probably appropriate for the audiences of their time but I'd argue Casablanca has a lot more enduring power. And it's less than half the fucking running time.

"Whatever barbarity or brutishness of Rhett's they were trying to convey is completely undercut by the very next scene."

That's not what they were trying to convey...