Ostensibly Hoops

[eCat]

"But I do have to take exception to your believing we'll be a top 3 team next year with this same cast of soft, underachieving characters."

Well, I agree that these guys aren't of the caliber that we have seen plenty of years in Chapel Hill, but they're not terrible. And I don't see next year's incoming freshman class to be as spectacular (or even close) to many we've seen in recent years. So for UNC, it's going to be addition by subtraction. I think several of our guys should be much better next year just b/c of the freshman bump (Jackson and esp. Pinson) and Hicks has shown great improvement this year over last, as has Meeks. If that trajectory continues and Paige returns to last year's form, I think we'll be pretty good next year. And I still think they're capable of winning a couple of games this year in the tourny that they "shouldn't" win. Of course, they could also lose in the first or second round. But I think we'll probably be the best (or among the best) of a not so great bunch next year. Basically it's not that we're going to be some kind of powerhouse next year, but that it's not going to be a stellar year for college hoops in general. But at this point, I'll take what I can get...

alot of teams are going to be better next year. I think its going to shape up to be a highly competitive season.

[aTm]

it started out badly - I didn't watch the end

I don't truly believe that calling a timeout or not turned the game around, and there were a couple of media timeouts in there, but if there was ever a time to call one in it was in the first 5 minutes of that game.

[hedge]

" I was one of his loudest critics with the way he finagled the baton handoff to a tired, old assistant coach, who absolutely threw away a national championship in 1998."

Amen, brother. I had this debate with my brother a few days ago. Basically if Dean had announced before the '98 season that it was going to be his last, there is no way Jamison, Carter and Co. wouldn't have brought home a championship (with the kicker being beating UK for the title). That was, IMO, the best Carolina team ever, with Carolina's best player (while at Carolina) ever, Jamison. Then he calls Roy back in, who would have come at that point, with no real hard feelings from KU fans, b/c he wasn't really that entrenched at that time. He would've come in, not missed a beat in recruiting, we would've avoided the Doh years completely, and be sitting on 8 or 9 national championships and the all time wins record and clearly been the #1 team in college hoops history. But nooooooooo. Dean HAD to give Ol' Baldy the reigns, giving Roy 3 more years to get entrenched and in love with KU and then gosh darn it not being able to turn his back on them when Dean and Baldy FINALLY get around to telling him it's time to come home. What arrogance. What a clusterfuck.

I understand that Dean wanted to reward Gut for his years of service, but fuck it, the Ram's Club could've found a way to compensate Gut in some other way. And it's not like Gut NEEDED to be the head coach, he was humble enough that he rejected many offers from other schools over the years, he was perfectly happy with his role as assistant to Dean. THAT is true humility and understanding one's place, but (again) nooooo, Dean HAD to thrust the job onto him, a job he didn't really want and a job that should've gone to Roy in 1999. End the millennium with Roy and start the new one with him, and he hits that ground running and we would now be the clear #1 program in college hoops history. BUT NOOOOOOOOOOOO, Dean fucked it all up....

[hedge]

"alot of teams are going to be better next year. I think its going to shape up to be a highly competitive season."

It probably will be competitive, but I don't see an alltime powerhouse out there next year. And other teams probably will get better, but I doubt anybody else out there (except Carolina) is bringing everybody back. In short, Carolina will go undefeated next year...

[The Anti k*]

Hedge, I've been labeled "not a real Carolina fan" by the fambly inbreeders too many times to count. I mean Jesus Christ, The Program is bigger than any individual. The majority of our fanbase treats the UNC head coach like a deity/dictator, who can do no wrong. We even had them defending the Dohnut when he was pissing on the ruins of the Heel Hoops Empire. Roy's had his day in the sun. He had the best five-year stretch in the history of The Program. Two Titles, another Final Four, an Elite Eight that was a 5 minute collapse from another Final Four, and a young team of overachievers, led by a high school football star (David Noel), who would rip the nutsacks off the wusses on this squad for playing transvestite style basketball. That's a helluva legacy.

But the stakes are too high to fuck up this next hire. k*rzythead, Boeheim, and Pitino are all nearing the end, opening up jobs at three of the top 10 programs. What if Calipari goes undefeated and Lebron orders Cleveland to offer him complete control of the Cavs? Others have wondered the same thing about Self and the NBA. We have GOT to get a jump on bringing in the best coach available to Carolina. I truly believe that man is Shaka Smart. Our brand is withering on the vine. Everything about the program is outdated. It's time to move the Program forward by making a bold move.

[eCat]

The fans often talk about Cal's replacement

I'm at a point where I don't think Cal's replacement is yet a big name and that Cal is going to stick it out for 4 more years then drop the mic and leave.

But we have a blueprint for UK that has led to unprecedented success for the program, and I am at a loss as to why anyone would want to suggest someone other than a coach with those experiences.

1. Took a team to the final four with your own recruits (bonus points if you made the national title game)
2. NBA pipeline or connections
3. Larger than life personality with fans/press/etc

Some of the fans are fixated on Sean Miller or Bennett - both very good coaches, but yet to prove they do nothing more than give us 8 years of Tubby Smith again.

To me its stupid to consider anyone that doesn't have that criteria, because even back in '89, Pitino could walk into a recruits home and talk to them about what it takes to make it to the NBA - and having a credible game plan to turn a kid of modest means into a multi-millionaire is going to go a long way in trumping whatever else another coach is going to bring to the table.

So that said, I would *NOT* want Shaka Smart at UNC - matter of fact, I think I'd take a more reasoned approach if in fact sanctions are looming over the program.

I would go with a hand picked Roy Williams disciple with the understanding he is just a placeholder until we decide and the minute Roy leaves, with your placeholder coach to get you thru the bullshit, I'd immediately start private discussions withcoaches across the nation. Imagine the opportunity it would represent to have a 2 or even 3 year window to land the best coach possible and give him the time to get his affairs in order.

[hedge]

"I'm at a point where I don't think Cal's replacement is yet a big name and that Cal is going to stick it out for 4 more years then drop the mic and leave."

See, I'm thinking that Cal has looked at Pitino and thought why would I want to leave this for the crap shoot that is the NBA? Why not stay here and become an alltime legend at one of the top (if not THE top) job in college basketball and that be my legacy? I think Cal really looks at somebody like Dean Smith and the Carolina program, with its family structure (mock it if you want, but it is definitely real and appreciated by players and fans alike), and he wants that. And he has started creating that at Kentucky. Throw in the fact that he's winning at an absurd rate and you've got a situation that I think would be very hard to walk away from.

Cal is too old to create any real legacy in the NBA. He's 56, if he leave in 4 years, he's already 60 years old. How many good years do you really have left at 60? 10? How many 70 year old NBA coaches are out there? And how many of those old guys are really great? Popovich, yeah, but who else? I just don't see why Cal would leave UK. It certainly wouldn't be for money. I guess I could see why somebody might rather be in New York or LA rather than Lexington (not dissing Lexington, just saying), but still. The only way Cal leaves would be to coach LeBron, but I still think he wants to be remembered in the same class as Wooden and Dean (b/c he'll never achieve the level of NBA greatness of Aurbach or Phil Jackson (unless he wins like 10 straight titles)), and to do that, he's right where he needs to be...

[eCat]

I don't think he does anything else after 4 years. He's said multiple times coaching at UK for a decade is all a guy can handle and I didn't think he'd last this long but recently because of his family and some other things, it appears he is looking at 4-5 years more. I'm convinced Cal has seen how well Joe B. Hall is treated and is determined to go out on top and be a living icon in the Lexington community. He may not live there - who knows but he wants a Coach Cal floor or student center or something.

First he has to make sure he eclipses Pitino.

He may go on to broadcasting but if he does it will just a be lark. He has all the money he needs.

[The Anti k*]

eCat -- If you were a Carolina fan, who would you want to succeed Roy? I saw your post above about a succession plan and going after the best coach available. But if not Shaka Smart, then who? We can forget Calipari and Self. Miller and Matta do not excite me in the least, though both are always complimentary of Carolina Basketball. I just don't know who would be better as a young coach than Shaka. Now if you think we could nab a big name, I'd be interested in hearing who you think that would be.

I'd take Billy Donovan in a heartbeat, but not sure he'd be interested in coming to Chapel Hill after not taking the Kentucky job. Plus, there was bad blood between him and Roy at one time (at least on Roy's end). Hmm...That makes me want him as our coach even more!

[sardis]

The way the winters have been here lately I doubt you get anyone from Florida moving up here.

[sardis]

I don't think he does anything else after 4 years. He's said multiple times coaching at UK for a decade is all a guy can handle and I didn't think he'd last this long but recently because of his family and some other things, it appears he is looking at 4-5 years more. I'm convinced Cal has seen how well Joe B. Hall is treated and is determined to go out on top and be a living icon in the Lexington community. He may not live there - who knows but he wants a Coach Cal floor or student center or something.

First he has to make sure he eclipses Pitino.

He may go on to broadcasting but if he does it will just a be lark. He has all the money he needs.

He will stay another 6 years until his son graduates from college. He will be such a mega god to the Kentucky faithful by then that he will demand his son be his successor and they will oblige.

[Jungle Rat]

eCat -- If you were a Carolina fan, who would you want to succeed Roy? I saw your post above about a succession plan and going after the best coach available. But if not Shaka Smart, then who? We can forget Calipari and Self. Miller and Matta do not excite me in the least, though both are always complimentary of Carolina Basketball. I just don't know who would be better as a young coach than Shaka. Now if you think we could nab a big name, I'd be interested in hearing who you think that would be.

I'd take Billy Donovan in a heartbeat, but not sure he'd be interested in coming to Chapel Hill after not taking the Kentucky job. Plus, there was bad blood between him and Roy at one time (at least on Roy's end). Hmm...That makes me want him as our coach even more!

Mick Cronin. But he won't go there considering the scandal

[eCat]

eCat -- If you were a Carolina fan, who would you want to succeed Roy? I saw your post above about a succession plan and going after the best coach available. But if not Shaka Smart, then who? We can forget Calipari and Self. Miller and Matta do not excite me in the least, though both are always complimentary of Carolina Basketball. I just don't know who would be better as a young coach than Shaka. Now if you think we could nab a big name, I'd be interested in hearing who you think that would be.

I'd take Billy Donovan in a heartbeat, but not sure he'd be interested in coming to Chapel Hill after not taking the Kentucky job. Plus, there was bad blood between him and Roy at one time (at least on Roy's end). Hmm...That makes me want him as our coach even more!

For Carolina?

Brad Stevens

[AlabamAlum]

Anthony GRANT!

[crotch]

[img2]http://kentuckysportsradio.com/wp-conte ... 915748.jpg[/img2]

[crotch]

[youtube]pR8mrXUldkM[/youtube]

[Saint]

what's killing Roy and UNC now is the spectre of an NCAA investigation hanging over its head. Rival recruiters are telling kids UNC is going to be on probation and it's apparent. Roy has only signed 1 kid, Mark Maye's kid who is barely top 100 and probably only because he signed with UNC. Granted if the Heels don't have any defections, it won't hurt as much next year but you can't have recruiting gaps like that. And as long as the OAD system is in place, you'd better try to compete with K and Calipari for those top 25 recruits.

People can bash Roy for his coaching but he's got a team of average (by elite college standards) players. Tokoto, Meeks, Johnson are nowhere near the class of the UK big men or even Winslow or Okafor at Duke. The backcourt of Paige and Britt is OK but they aren't really great outside shooters. So you have a team without much 3-point shooting and subpar post players and you get a 22-12 record. The UNC fans who think their players are better than they really are just get upset with the coach but for the wrong reasons.

[Saint]

I don't think there is a snowballs chance in hell that UNC keeps it in the family after Roy. Roy will not be able to hand pick a successor.

There is no family, at least guys who played for or coached under Dean. Roy has spawned some coaches but those guys are from KU, not UNC. No, UNC is moving onto the next thing when Roy decides to retire.

However, it will be interesting to see if Duke goes the family route when K hangs it up. There are some good candidates but it's going to be a tough job to take following K and I don't know who would dare try. Maybe Collins is dumb enough.

Just like there won't be another Dean in Chapel Hill, there won't be another K in Durham.

[Saint]

Hedge, I've been labeled "not a real Carolina fan" by the fambly inbreeders too many times to count. I mean Jesus Christ, The Program is bigger than any individual. The majority of our fanbase treats the UNC head coach like a deity/dictator, who can do no wrong. We even had them defending the Dohnut when he was pissing on the ruins of the Heel Hoops Empire. Roy's had his day in the sun. He had the best five-year stretch in the history of The Program. Two Titles, another Final Four, an Elite Eight that was a 5 minute collapse from another Final Four, and a young team of overachievers, led by a high school football star (David Noel), who would rip the nutsacks off the wusses on this squad for playing transvestite style basketball. That's a helluva legacy.

But the stakes are too high to fuck up this next hire. k*rzythead, Boeheim, and Pitino are all nearing the end, opening up jobs at three of the top 10 programs. What if Calipari goes undefeated and Lebron orders Cleveland to offer him complete control of the Cavs? Others have wondered the same thing about Self and the NBA. We have GOT to get a jump on bringing in the best coach available to Carolina. I truly believe that man is Shaka Smart. Our brand is withering on the vine. Everything about the program is outdated. It's time to move the Program forward by making a bold move.

Dude, really? Shaka Smart? C'mon.

There is nothing outdated about UNC other than a potential NCAA investigation that is killing recruiting that was already slipping. Every time UNC has won a championship, it's because they have gotten 1 or 2 of the top classes in the previous 3-4 years. The last time Roy had such a class or classes, it proved to be a disappointment for nearly 2 years until they finally got it together somewhat. Since then (and maybe some of that has coincided with the academic issues), he's pretty much whiffed on the big-time players. Paige is probably the highest rated recruit and he's actually exceeded my expectations. I thought the freshmen this year would be better and maybe that's a knock on Roy that they aren't playing more. But Johnson, Meeks, Tokoto, Hicks — those guys are just sparring partners.

I never thought Roy was a great coach as much as he was a great recruiter. That seems to have fallen off a lot, mostly due to the NCAA thing. I know this season and last have been extremely tough on him, with the PJ Hairston thing, the academic issues, the loss of a close friend and now the loss of Dean Smith (although he pretty much has been gone for a few years). You can see how much Roy has aged in his face. I haven't been to a game and sat in front of him since 2008-09 but I can see on TV that he has really aged, much like a president does in office. I doubt this is his last season but I wonder if he'll be there in 3 years.

[eCat]

At this point the recruiting might be suffering because of the impeding sanctions but Roy has a reputation for holding players back and not jumping on the one and done bandwagon.

its not about what the kid can do for UNC - that was 1995. This is what can you do for the kid - and if you're pitching a quality 4 year degree as the lead point you're going to be on the outside looking in.