The Goat Pen

AlabamAlum wrote:Considering everything, Cruz' speech was subdued. Surprised he didn't do much worse. I mean, forget Cruz' ugly wife, but to say your dad had a hand in the assassination of JFK?


DS: with poll numbers essentialy even between Trump and HRC, I don't think that was the plan. I truly believe that Trump's camp expected him to acquiesce, at least to a degree. If Trump had been 5-8 points down, maybe, just to get people talking, but with the way things are now, no need for that play.

Their internal polling may show something different once they factor in projections about how undecideds may break.

DooKSucks wrote:

AlabamAlum wrote:Considering everything, Cruz' speech was subdued. Surprised he didn't do much worse. I mean, forget Cruz' ugly wife, but to say your dad had a hand in the assassination of JFK?


DS: with poll numbers essentialy even between Trump and HRC, I don't think that was the plan. I truly believe that Trump's camp expected him to acquiesce, at least to a degree. If Trump had been 5-8 points down, maybe, just to get people talking, but with the way things are now, no need for that play.

Their internal polling may show something different once they factor in projections about how undecideds may break.

alot of people think Johnson is taking away votes from Trump, but I don't see it that way. Johnson is open borders, open trade and light on foreign policy. I'm sure there are some nevertrump people that are going to vote for him as an exercise in futility, but there will be just as many if not more people voting for Johnson as an alternative to Hillary. He is more closely aligned with her platform than Trumps...and his emergence, which might be coincidence , coincides with Trump leveling out in the polls with Hillary

eCat wrote:

aTm wrote:There are definitely many Trump crazies here, plus many who feel bound to vote "Not Hillary."

With regard to Cruz in particular, we elected him in the first place, hes our senator. I am certainly not plugged into statewide GOP politics but my guess is that standing up to someone who calls your dad a criminal, your wife ugly, and you a liar, is going to play well here. Much better than "being a pussy" and endorsing that guy would.

like I said, Texas people have a different take

whatever his motivations, it cost him the white house in 2020

Gotta agree with eCat here. Whatever fucktard Texans want to think or do about Ted Cruz is their own business, but he just ensured that all he'll ever be is a Texas politician at best, and not one who has a national role (pres or cabinet member) ever. Of course, US senator is a pretty prestigious role, but from all I've heard he is despised by his Senate colleagues. I'm sure some of them hate Trump even worse and may even support what he did, but in general he came across like a crybaby who got punched on the playground and took his ball home. Of course, that's how he generally came across before last night to a lot of people anyway, but that was shitastic display on national TV. I loved it...

LMAO. Ted Cruz with a Presidential plan. Bless his cold, arrogant, pompous, Wendigo-like heart.

Cruz could have come out in a Trump tee shirt covered in American flag pins, Benghazi proof in hand, a 1969 Hillary Clinton 8mm sex tape and a YouTube recorded endorsement from Jesus and still not have a shot at 2020...nor a shot in a cabinet position.

No one in power likes him (or, at least, not enough to trust him politically). The only reason he finished runner up was due to a horrible, but well-funded GOP field and Trump...who took so much TV time away from every other candidate that the American public did not have an opportunity to get skeeved out looking at his weasely face.

Heidi Cruz supported Ted's attempt at running because she had a dream/vision that God told her to. If that is true...and things play out the way it seems they may...then, per Heidi Cruz's God, He wanted Hillary Clinton to be President.

Bklyn wrote:LMAO.

Cruz could have come out in a Trump tee shirt covered in American flag pins, Benghazi proof in hand, a 1969 Hillary Clinton 8mm sex tape and a YouTube recorded endorsement from Jesus and still not have a shot at 2020...nor a shot in a cabinet position.

No one in power likes him (or, at least, not enough to trust him politically). The only reason he finished runner up was due to a horrible, but well-funded GOP field and Trump...who took so much TV time away from every other candidate that the American public did not have an opportunity to get skeeved out looking at his weasely face.

Heidi Cruz supported Ted's attempt at running because she had a dream/vision that God told her to. If that is true...and things play out the way it seems they may...then, per Heidi Cruz's God, He wanted Hillary Clinton to be President.

you're still thinking conventional politics. Until the GOP shakes out - and I don't think that will happen in 2020, the Bush/Romney/Rubio mold of politicians will still continue to dilute the field and be outright rejected in the voting base.

Cruz is monumentally pissed because from day 1, this whole outsider persona was a calculated move to launch himself toward the white house. He's a Bush guy who saw the shift in the disenfranchised voter, and took the gamble that attempting to shut down government/calling the RINO Senate Majority leader a liar on the senate floor and taking a stand on immigration (all contrary to what he practiced during his Bush era policy making) would give him the fast path to the white house.

Unfortunately for him, Trump's steamrolled him, taking the position of outsider away from him and casting him as lying Ted - the playground equivalent of calling him the stinky kid.

Trump inflicted alot of damage to Ted but I think it was recoverable for him , especially if Trump lost the election and Cruz returned to the Senate taking on the role as thorn in the side of Paul Ryan and feed off the collective hate of a Clinton white house extending the Obama legacy.

But he killed his shot last night. He essentially told people to vote for anyone but Trump. It was lunacy on his part. I suspect Nesse of Nebraska will step into that role now as the grass roots conservative torch bearer.

Trump ain't winning in November. Stop wasting your time.

Nesse, Ryan, Tom Cotton and probably some Conservative to be Named Later are the next generation. I hate to be overly simplistic, but I still think national politics is made up of SOME policy but it's mostly entertainment and emotion (when it comes to the election cycle). It's why the "who looks Presidential" and "who would you rather have a beer with" question carries weight, even though it means absolutely nothing.

That reason alone, I give Ted Cruz and Scott Walker very little chance of ever becoming president. One turns stomachs, the other looks like an idiot. Television time kills their numbers. It's a classic "a perfect face for radio" situation...

yes, I agree that neither looks presidential.

Cruz just looks like a used car salesman

I called him Nesse earlier, I meant to say Sasse

Sasse sound like a candidate the Goat Pen could get behind...

My favorite post of the day so far at texags...aimed at Ted Cruz and made by a guy who posts 20 pro Trump or anti-trump rival threads every day...

He's a narcissist!

Yes, I have to admit, the Trump people calling Ted a narcissist right now aren't making a very effective case.

This picture pretty much sums up Ted Cruz to me

"and Cruz returned to the Senate taking on the role as thorn in the side of Paul Ryan"

Paul Ryan is the face of the repub party for the next 4 years. I kept thinking Trump was going to implode this year and Ryan was going to step in, but no. Still, he'll have 4 years as Speaker under his belt when it comes time to start the 2020 campaign, he tall, young (for a presidential candidate), good looking, well spoken and seems to be pretty intelligent. Why the repubs haven't gotten behind him as a candidate yet I don't know (or maybe it was his team who didn't think this was the year to jump in - if so, he needs to keep that team intact), but I can't see anybody else for the repubs in 2020. Hell, I could see myself voting for him...

According to an article yesterday in the NYTimes (How Trump Picked His VP) Donald Trump Jr. called a Kasich representative a few weeks back to sound out the governor's interest in being veep. Young Trump said the V.P. in a Trump administration would handle "foreign affairs, as well as domestic." Incredulous, the aide asked junior what was left for the president to do? "Why, he'll make America great again" was the quoted reply.

Trump wants the title of president but he doesn't really want to put in the work, and it's being reflected in the shoddiness of his general election campaign. The gaffes used to be passed off as anti-status quo but now they're piling up in droves. The lack of key party support and donor money aren't symptoms, they're a death knell.

In my life I've never heard speculation that a major-party presidential candidate might quit the race months ahead of the general election if his poll numbers took a huge hit. These are strange times.

hedge wrote:"and Cruz returned to the Senate taking on the role as thorn in the side of Paul Ryan"

Paul Ryan is the face of the repub party for the next 4 years. I kept thinking Trump was going to implode this year and Ryan was going to step in, but no. Still, he'll have 4 years as Speaker under his belt when it comes time to start the 2020 campaign, he tall, young (for a presidential candidate), good looking, well spoken and seems to be pretty intelligent. Why the repubs haven't gotten behind him as a candidate yet I don't know (or maybe it was his team who didn't think this was the year to jump in - if so, he needs to keep that team intact), but I can't see anybody else for the repubs in 2020. Hell, I could see myself voting for him...

Paul Ryan dropped from 73% to 47% in polling in his home state for not supporting Trump and pushing for open borders.

He will be the establishment face of the GOP, but not supported by the voting public outside of Wisconsin, and apparently not as much in Wisconsin as he hoped.

His opponent is a dumbass who thinks wearing a sleeveless shirt , showing his tats and wearing aviators on a harley is a good campaign look, otherwise the gap would be even closer.

"Paul Ryan dropped from 73% to 47% in polling in his home state for not supporting Trump and pushing for open borders."

Like I said, this wasn't the year for what he represents. This was the year for the republican party to go off the rails and thus they have Donald Trump as the nominee. By 2020, when the party's brain trust will have had 4 years to digest this fiasco and strategize accordingly, Ryan will be the obvious choice...

hedge wrote:"Paul Ryan dropped from 73% to 47% in polling in his home state for not supporting Trump and pushing for open borders."

Like I said, this wasn't the year for what he represents. This was the year for the republican party to go off the rails and thus they have Donald Trump as the nominee. By 2020, when the party's brain trust will have had 4 years to digest this fiasco and strategize accordingly, Ryan will be the obvious choice...

right now I couldn't disagree more.

the GOP will never go back to an environment where a Paul Ryan, based on where he stands now , will be a leader to them.

I fully suspect a new party is going to emerge in the next 10 years or the GOP is going to change platform planks

Trump - Caeser
Cruz - Brutus

Currently the GOP platform is nationalist. Whether this is really being driven by a geopolitical worldwide trend (similar to rises in nationalism in Europe driving forces like Brexit, etc) or simply a weird confluence of events swirling around only Trump and will disappear when he's gone, I am not really sure. There's always been a "Merica, fuck yeah!" bent to the GOP thats been growing very strong esp following 9/11. But its always seemed to be more of an identity thing rather than a driver of the party platform. The typical bread and butter conservative is gonna divide into factions if this is a permanent move for the GOP. The GOP will keep the social conservative type, Christian righties who want government to legislate morality, which goes well with nationalism, and they'll keep and add to the "They took our jawbs!" anti-immigration, anti-free trade, American supremacist nationalist type. The small government conservatives though, won't really fit in a statist, nationalist type party currently personified by Trump.

small government is a pipe dream of conservatives and libertarians.

but creating less regulation/government influence - both in our lives and to some extent the business environment isn't

I don't believe that even creating less regulation/government interference is a Trump plank. Trump is running on a protectionist domestic policy. He would want to roll back deregulation and take steps backwards on free trade. He's definitely not running on reducing tax burdens or balancing the budget by cutting spending or anything like that that I can tell.