The Goat Pen

Rich people buy a lot more shit.

Red Bird wrote:There isn't a business man on earth who is dumb enough to invest in new production if their isn't anyone with money to buy whatever he makes.

No, but we have federal government agencies that you and I subsidize with our tax dollars that try and sell passenger rail tickets to a non-existent marketplace. We do this to create jobs and give pensions to our useless, civil-service, brain-dead. I guess you are going to say this helps our economy?

Rich people buy a lot more shit.

I'm sure they do, but there are far fewer of them.

A thousand poor people spending their tens and twenties at Wal Mart, helps the economy more than a dozen rich people charging expensive dinners at Mastro's Ocean Club.

1. What is this letting them make more money? Should govt determine all wages? If you said letting them KEEP more of what they earn, fine.

I think it benefits the economy if low income people make more money.

2. Who are these rich folks you know that are sending money overseas in non-taxed investments? Is there anything to back that up? Why did cap gains revenue go UP each year if they were in non-taxed investments?

You haven't heard of people stashing their money in overseas bank accounts that don't pay US taxes? They exist. For real. I don't have their bank account numbers though.

The IRS is going after those people much more now. New tax legislation in 2007 has made it easier to do this.

if people don't have the money to buy whatever his/her business makes.


How many people (% wise) owned a car...TV...computer...microwave...boat...washing machine...when they were first introduced?

Toemeesleather wrote:if people don't have the money to buy whatever his/her business makes.


How many people (% wise) owned a car...TV...computer...microwave...boat...washing machine...when they first introduced?

at first, only rich people

Hell, how about a VCR for that matter

No, but we have federal government agencies that you and I subsidize with our tax dollars that try and sell passenger rail tickets to a non-existent marketplace. We do this to create jobs and give pensions to our useless, civil-service, brain-dead. I guess you are going to say this helps our economy?

Anything that puts money in people hands right now will help the economy. What we need is more people spending money, the value of those people's effort is a secondary consideration.

The point is that an economy in which 100% of the people have money to spend works much better than an economy where only 50% or 60% of the people have money to spend. If you have young children, they probably don't do much productive labor, but if you give them money to spend, they are still helping the economy by creating demand.

We'd be better off to give poor people money to spend so that they can buy things than to let the whole economy collapse because these people can't find work.

"...even those living on welfare are spending which is good for the economy & creates jobs. For instance, if I have a store where the majority of my customers are welfare recipients, an increased income for them translates into more $$ for my business. With enough of an increase, I will need to hire more help."

Not if you have to pay more in taxes to support the person who just made their purchase with welfare money that came from you in the first place. And that was before it was filtered through a hugely inefficient government bureaucracy, with all the hands that take a piece before it funnels down to the welfare recipient. A very small segment of the market might benefit (convenience stores in poor neighborhoods, for instance), but the net effect on the economy as a whole is a loss.

We'd be better off to give poor people money to spend so that they can buy things


Please feel free to hand over all the $$$ you want to....

If you want people to have money to spend, close the damn borders and stop sending our jobs overseas. Treat companies that move production to Mexico as a foreign entity and charge them import fee. Many Honda automobiles are more American than many Fords.

Hacksaw wrote:"...even those living on welfare are spending which is good for the economy & creates jobs. For instance, if I have a store where the majority of my customers are welfare recipients, an increased income for them translates into more $$ for my business. With enough of an increase, I will need to hire more help."

Not if you have to pay more in taxes to support the person who just gave you their welfare money, which came from you in the first place. And that was before it was filtered through the huge inefficient government bureaucracy, with all the hands that take a piece before it funnels down to the welfare recipient. A very small segment of the market might benefit (convenience stores in poor neighborhoods, for instance), but the net effect on the economy on the whole is a loss.

Stop it Hack. Your making sense.

I think the subsidized freebie's should start at the tittie bar.

The U.S. regulations, known as the Foreign Account Compliance Tax Act, were signed into law by President Barack Obama last year and are scheduled to come into effect in 18 months.

The IRS estimates that it will collect more than $165 billion in additional taxes from overseas Americans over the next decade through the act.

Red Bird wrote:

No, but we have federal government agencies that you and I subsidize with our tax dollars that try and sell passenger rail tickets to a non-existent marketplace. We do this to create jobs and give pensions to our useless, civil-service, brain-dead. I guess you are going to say this helps our economy?

Anything that puts money in people hands right now will help the economy. What we need is more people spending money, the value of those people's effort is a secondary consideration.

Make the argument you just made in any political debate and the side that wouldn't vote for you would laugh at you and the side that wanted to vote for you, would beg you to get off the stage. You don't know what you are talking about....

This is not Mexico Red Bird where the "economy" is people try and sell things to Gringos just coming off the ship/airplane at "barter prices" that happen to be five to ten times what the natives paid to buy those same goods new at Wal-Mart. Ours is a real economy. In the first world, VALUE for the effort is of UTMOST importance, particularly in the private sector.

Results.

GBJs wrote:

Hacksaw wrote:"...even those living on welfare are spending which is good for the economy & creates jobs. For instance, if I have a store where the majority of my customers are welfare recipients, an increased income for them translates into more $$ for my business. With enough of an increase, I will need to hire more help."

Not if you have to pay more in taxes to support the person who just gave you their welfare money, which came from you in the first place. And that was before it was filtered through the huge inefficient government bureaucracy, with all the hands that take a piece before it funnels down to the welfare recipient. A very small segment of the market might benefit (convenience stores in poor neighborhoods, for instance), but the net effect on the economy on the whole is a loss.

Stop it Hack. Your making sense.

there is a whole black market economy for food stamps. the food stamp recipient gets their stamps/food-debit-card and sells that to someone who doesn't qualify for 50 cents on the food-stamp-dollar. the buyer now just doubled their grocery buying power while the seller has cash for alcohol and cigarettes.

and the government underwrites all of this. must be great for the economy

THE_WIZARD_ wrote:I think the subsidized freebie's should start at the tittie bar.

i don't go to any nudie bar that doesn't take food stamps at the door for the cover charge. i want the government to subsidize my lap dance

Jesus hates your guts...

Make the argument you just made in any political debate and the side that wouldn't vote for you would laugh at you and the side that wanted to vote for you, would beg you to get off the stage.

That would only prove how little people understand the situation we're in.