Toronto Raptors - We can't be pathetic forever, can we?

[yossarian1234]

It's not all about how good DeRozan is, it also has to do with supply and demand. There are bound to be teams under the cap that lose out on big name FA's but still feel obligated to use the cap room. With quite a few of DeRozan's class that's worth anything already signed to extensions, who out there is left for those teams to spend the money on? DeRozan may not become good enough to warrant that contract this year, although contract year does wonders for some people, but he may improve just enough for some team to throw crazy money on him. Look at how much some of these guys are signing for, I think it's definitely possible. We match, we'll be in a worse situation capwise, if we don't we lose him for nothing. It all depends on what he's willing to sign him right now that would make locking him up now worth it. I'm not entirely happy with $$ involved but I think it's still worth it to lock him up with that money. Just barely but still worth it.

BTW loving the combination of Android tab and NBA League pass. I can stop paying those greedy cable company tons of money and get all those unnecessary channles just to watch Raptors. Hopefully, I can conitnue to bypass the blackout.

[yossarian1234]

This team lacks a good closer. They look lost in close games. Fields has been a disaster so far and Casey is falling too much in love with 2 PG lineup probably as a byproduct. It's not too bad during the course of the game in the middle but down the stretch, too much of a liability on defense especially when you already got a guy like Bargnani out there. The other team's offense just eating it up down the stretch but our offense can't make up for it.

[T Dot O Dot]

my years in middle-management have finally paid off, I have seats behind the brooklyn bench for the december 12th game

it's always great getting tix due to 10 degrees of refusal

even during a hockey lockout

[sotola]

Bargnani looks like the disinterested Bargnani from the year before. It's pretty sad when the announcers have to give him special credit for grabbing a board (his 2nd of the night) in the last few minutes because he grabbed it with authority.

They absolutely lack a closer amongst other things.

It's early but your best players have to be your best players. Bargnani and De Rozan seem lost for long stretches of the games.

[T Dot O Dot]

he's a one way player, and if he's not firing from long range he brings nothing else to the table

DeRozan, to a lesser degree, is very much the same

if his offense isnt clicking he doesnt really effect the game.... just disappears

and that is the frustration, if these guys would rebound, get steals, grab loose balls & somehow produce when the going gets tough.. we'd close out alot more of these 50-50 games

[T Dot O Dot]

coffee is for closers

[hedge]

"What's your name?"

"'Fuck you'. THAT'S my name!"

[T Dot O Dot]

allen anderson, michigan state euroleague journeyman

outplays landry fields and takes all of his minutes

am I the only one who thinks this is not just a blip on the radar?

[sotola]

Like I said, he reminds me a lot of Doug Christie at the same age. I had given up on Christie but then the lightbulb went on. I will be more patient this time. As for Anderson, I still think it will be a blip long term but I don't necessarily think fields won't be replaced by someone. We have a few guys who are comparable but no one clearly superior.

[yossarian1234]

You aren't the only one, he's the next Kapono, Turkoglu or Kleiza. Colangelo should just quit with free agency especially if he's looking at SF. And Bargnani's having a very bad start as well. It looks like what we saw early last season was a fluke and what we saw late in the year is more of the norm.

Really, this should be Colangelo's last year unless he can pull some rabit out of the hat and turn Bargnani and Calderon into a quality starting SF and turn Fields into a useful rotation player in trades.

We aren't going to get a closer with those players but if we can get some decent performances out of the wing other than DeRozan, this team could make some noise.

[yossarian1234]

Doug Christie? I don't see the comparison. Neither skills wise or athletically. Fields just isn't there.

[sotola]

Doug Christie? I don't see the comparison. Neither skills wise or athletically. Fields just isn't there.

Actually, I compared them to the same stage in their career and you are right, fields is actually a better player at 24 years of age. As for "skills wise or athletically" and your rants about Colangelo.... when you get that job in the NBA that you THINK you are qualified for, I will recant my opinion. You always comment about all the things that are so easy to do like build a team without free agency and turning 2nd rounders into all stars EXCEPT that no other GM in the sport has been able to build teams like that. The reality is few teams have the allure to attract GOOD free agents and most teams don't win the draft with multiple lottery picks.

The problem with your rants is that they lack anything substantive except anger about the team's plight. I wish the team could be great as well..... but I don't think Bosh, TMac, or VC wanting out of town is really the GM's fault.... and you usually build teams around your best players. Yes, I also wish that Colangelo could pull off some miracle trade where he totally fleeces the other GM but how many GM's you know want to do those types of deals with him? the reality is that we can't get good free agents which means the building process will be longer, and probably, painful. The sooner you deal with it, the easier it will be

[yossarian1234]

Dude, you really need to take your head out of your ass.

Either you need to take reading comprehension 101 or you need to get whatever's frustrating you in your life and get it straightened out. Seriously, I'm sick of you implying something I never said or implied whatsoever. Kinda sad what you've had to resort to.

Fuck off.

I'll say one thing though. Look at Colangelo's history with free agency especially at SF. I've already listed them all. All of them spectacular failures. However, he has done one thing well throughout his years here, that is turn those failures and turn it into something useful or save some grace through trades. I don't think any of them were long term solutions but enough to save face. If he can do that with Calderon, Bargnani, and Fields, as he has shown he can do (I mean he's got out of that horrible contract with Turkoglu, after all, which I thought wasn't possible), then that might help save his job.

[sotola]

I was gonna start my post off by calling you names but I won't lower myself.

What did I imply? Did you not state that we "wasted a 2nd round pick for a guy that would be out of the league in a few years"? (like almost every other 2nd rounder)??? How can it be a "waste" if 2nd rounders rarely amount to anything? Your stupid rant on the subject just shows that if you can't hear yourself bitching then you must feel that you are not alive.

The rest of my post is simple basketball... you build around your best players and our best players have continually left the organization. And none of the best players in the Colangelo era were superstars. bosh was very good but not a superstar. Barring a fleecing of a team, no trades would have made this team substantially better.... and when you can't sign GOOD free agents, it's hard to deliver a great team. If you can honestly say that this line up isn't a lot better than 3 years ago, you truly do not know basketball at all and should be barred from commenting again. Are they guaranteed of the playoffs? Nope... because once again, our best players aren't superstars which makes it practically impossible.

It's not rocket science and it's easy to say "he should be fired unless he craps golden eggs" but the reality is we are the hinterland of basketball for free agents and that's not easy to overcome. I can't honestly think of one player outside of Valanciunas and Lowry that would really make any GM's salivate so our trade options are practically non-existant. The sad part is that our best chance to rebuild was that horrible draft that we won the rights to draft Bargnani. Any other year would have given us a player to truly build around. With Roy's career all but over, Bargnani could still end out being the best player from that draft and he will probably never be an all star.... that's the sad but pathetic truth. that's just bad luck on timing. Complain all you want but no GM is gonna fix the mess in this town without winning the lottery.... or at least getting a bonafide stud that you don't typically find at 8-12. and MLSE won't let the team tank so an instant rebuild is not an option.... that's not the GM, that's ownership.

Colangelo has really only made two mistakes imo... Turkoglu was the biggest. Fields was a calculated gamble and he knew full well that he was overpaying but I want my GM to try and improve the team rather than be fearful of failure. Lowry was a risky trade but he has talent and shows the team wants to improve. that's better than sitting around, being crap, and hoping you win the lottery.

Kapono - sure, signing the best long range shooter for two straight years to a mid level exemption for a team that was supposed to work inside/out seemed utterly stupid, right? and yet, we got Reggie Evans and a shorter contract in return via trade. Kleiza - if 3 years, 15M is a horrible deal then the NBA has a whole flock of GMs that suck because a whole bunch of players make that kind of money and provide the same results. Add in the fact that Kleiza has been injured alot (despite not having a history of injuries prior to TO) and I really don't see any evidence whatsoever of why that signing was a bad signing. and if you saw the Olympics, Kleiza was phenomenol... not just good but very good.

I share your frustration with the teams fortunes but we have had few assets to deal since the VC dismantling trade. Even when the team considered moving Bosh, the most persistent rumour was Anthony Randolph of Golden State..... that's how pitiful his trade value was.

[Simitar]

IWith Roy's career all but over, Bargnani could still end out being the best player from that draft and he will probably never be an all star.... that's the sad but pathetic truth. that's just bad luck on timing.

That was a shitty draft, but Bargnani is never going to be in the conversation with Rondo or even Aldridge.

[sotola]

I will give ya Rondo but Aldridge isn't anything spectacular. I would have taken Bargnani last season over Aldridge any day. This season he has regressed again (although it's early). But it's more about his desire than anything for me.... shots will go in or they won't but as long as you put forth effort, you can be useful. Bargani hasn't been at all.

....but the point was that we finally won a draft and the best you can get is Aldridge, Bargnani or Roy (who had injury concerns which proved to be legit)? or you have to hope a player taken in the 20s is the best player of the draft.

the org has been snake bitten since VC gave up.

[Simitar]

Even last year Aldridge over Bargnani was an absolute no-brainer.

LMA beat him in TS%, eFG%, rebounding rate (especially on the offensive glass), higher assist, block and steal rates and a lower turnover rate. WP48, WS48 and PER all favored LMA greatly. Defensively, Aldridge's counterparts faired much worse than Bargnani's.

The only areas Bargnani beat out Aldridge were getting to the line (and making FTs) and he shot a better % from 3 (although he took far too many for how badly he shot them).

[sotola]

Honestly Sim.... I don't care enough to argue it since I don't think either player is that phenomenol. My point is that to even be able to "consider" Bargnani as one of the best of that draft says how crap it was. I think Aldridge is a bench player on a good team and yet he is one of the best of that draft.... pitiful.

[Jungle Rat]

Never thought I'd ever see 2 Canucks arguing over basketball. Ever.

[sotola]

VC says he would like to come back and finish his career in Toronto (or something to that extent)

.... wow, nothing like rubbing salt into a wound.