Florida State Seminoles

[Red Bird]

So, the resolutions don't really offer us much help in deciphering the United States changing position of the refugee mater.

[Owlman]

(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict;

The resolutions don't offer much? Not true at all. They tell you all you need to know. All that you posted still supports the point, there was no change in this President's statement and previous policy. Bush specifically referenced 242 containing the above quote. I understand that you didn't know that this was the case, but it is there.

[AugustWest]

owlman...

The love of learning is the most important thing; unless you play football for Carolina. Then banging the right tutor is paramount.

fixed your sig.

[Owlman]

A true statement but true for virtually every college football player everywhere (except Rice of course)

[Jungle Rat]

[youtube]CMNry4PE93Y[/youtube]

[Jungle Rat]

Why does eCat hate Hollywood?

[innocentbystander]

The other point often in dispute is section "b"

(b) For achieving a just settlement of the refugee problem;

Note that the Palestinians are not mentioned anywhere in Resolution 242.

Red Bird, what exactly (precisely) IS a Palestinian?

http://www.terrorism101.org/archive/larry_miller.html

A brief overview of the situation is always valuable, so as a service to all Americans who still don't get it, I now offer you the story of the Middle East in just a few paragraphs, which is all you really need. Don't thank me. I'm a giver.

Here we go: the Palestinians want their own country. There's just one thing about that: There are no Palestinians.

It's a made up word.

Israel was called Palestine for two thousand years. Like "Wiccan," "Palestinian" sounds ancient but is really a modern invention. Before the Israelis won the land in war, Gaza was owned by Egypt, and there were no "Palestinians" then, and the West Bank was owned by Jordan, and there were no "Palestinians" then. As soon as the Jews took over and started growing oranges as big as basketballs, what do you know, say hello to the "Palestinians," weeping for their deep bond with their lost "land" and "nation." So for the sake of honesty, let's not use the word "Palestinian" any more to describe these delightful folks, who dance for joy at our deaths until someone points out they're being taped. Instead, let's call them what they are: "Other Arabs From The Same General Area Who Are In Deep Denial About Never Being Able To Accomplish Anything In Life And Would Rather Wrap Themselves In The Seductive Melodrama Of Eternal Struggle And Death."

I know that's a bit unwieldy to expect to see on CNN. How about this, then: "Adjacent Jew-Haters."

Okay, so the Adjacent Jew-Haters want their own country. Oops, just one more thing. No, they don't. They could've had their own country any time in the last thirty years, especially two years ago at Camp David. But if you have your own country, you have to have traffic lights and garbage trucks and Chambers of Commerce, and, worse, you actually have to figure out some way to make a living. That's no fun.

No, they want what all the other Jew-Haters in the region want: Israel. They also want a big pile of dead Jews, of course-that's where the real fun is-but mostly they want Israel.

Why? For one thing, trying to destroy Israel-or "The Zionist Entity" as their textbooks call it-for the last fifty years has allowed the rulers of Arab countries to divert the attention of their own people away from the fact that they're the blue-ribbon most illiterate, poorest, and tribally backward on God's Earth, and if you've ever been around God's Earth, you know that's really saying something. It makes me roll my eyes every time one of our pundits waxes poetic about the great history and culture of the Muslim MidEast.

Unless I'm missing something, the Arabs haven't given anything to the world since Algebra, and, by the way, thanks a hell of a lot for that one. Chew this around and spit it out: Five hundred million Arabs; five million Jews. Think of all the Arab countries as a football field, and Israel as a pack of matches sitting in the middle of it.

And now these same folks swear that if Israel gives them half of that pack of matches, everyone will be pals. Really? Wow, what neat news. Hey, but what about the string of wars to obliterate the tiny country and the constant din of rabid blood oaths to drive every Jew into the sea?

Oh, that? We were just kidding.

My friend Kevin Rooney made a gorgeous point the other day: Just reverse the numbers. Imagine five hundred million Jews and five million Arabs. I was stunned at the simple brilliance of it. Can anyone picture the Jews strapping belts of razor blades and dynamite to themselves? Of course not. Or marshalling every fiber and force at their disposal for generations to drive a tiny Arab state into the sea? Nonsense. Or dancing for joy at the murder of innocents?

Impossible. Or spreading and believing horrible lies about the Arabs baking their bread with the blood of children? Disgusting. No, as you know, left to themselves in a world of peace, the worst Jews would ever do to people is debate them to death.

Mr. Bush, God bless him, is walking a tightrope. I understand that with vital operations coming up against Iraq and others, it's in our interest, as Americans, to try to stabilize our Arab allies as much as possible, and, after all, that can't be much harder than stabilizing a roomful of supermodels who've just had their drugs taken away. However, in any big-picture strategy, there's always a danger of losing moral weight. We've already lost some. After September 11 our president told us and the world he was going to root out all terrorists and the countries that supported them. Beautiful.

Then the Israelis, after months and months of having the equivalent of an Oklahoma City every week (and then every day) start to do the same thing we did, and we tell them to show restraint. If America were being attacked with an Oklahoma City every day, we would all very shortly be screaming for the administration to just be done with it and kill everything south of the Mediterranean and east of the Jordan. (Hey, wait a minute, that's actually not such a bad idea... uh, that is, what a horrible thought, yeah, horrible.)

[Jungle Rat]

Cliff Notes?

[Owlman]

if someone could tell me one significant example of how an alliance with Israel serves Americas goals I'd love to hear it.

Everyone tells me we must support the only democracy in the middle east. Yet there is no reciprocity in the agreement.

exerpt from eCat rant. Was hoping someone would answer this question.

[Jungle Rat]

Aren't their like 9 Jewish guys somewhere in New York running things?

[Bklyn]

if someone could tell me one significant example of how an alliance with Israel serves Americas goals I'd love to hear it.

For those Evangelical politicians* who believe in Israel's role in the return of Jesus...and the boundaries of the Holy Land as defined in the Old Testament.

* now, I don't believe many of them truly exist, but they have constituents who take it seriously

[innocentbystander]

if someone could tell me one significant example of how an alliance with Israel serves Americas goals I'd love to hear it.

Everyone tells me we must support the only democracy in the middle east. Yet there is no reciprocity in the agreement.

exerpt from eCat rant. Was hoping someone would answer this question.

http://www.goatpen.net/viewtopic.php?f= ... =740#p5635

It is not that it serves America's goals so much as (helping Israel) makes Americans who feel "gulity" are free to feel "less guilty"....

You don't care about reciprocity (so much) if you feel that you have "wronged" your partner in some terrible manner in the past.

[Bklyn]

Ailes lost control of Beck and how that may have impacted the 2012 race...

http://nymag.com/print/?/news/media/rog ... ws-2011-5/

[eCat]

if someone could tell me one significant example of how an alliance with Israel serves Americas goals I'd love to hear it.

Everyone tells me we must support the only democracy in the middle east. Yet there is no reciprocity in the agreement.

exerpt from eCat rant. Was hoping someone would answer this question.

http://www.goatpen.net/viewtopic.php?f= ... =740#p5635

It is not that it serves America's goals so much as (helping Israel) makes Americans who feel "gulity" are free to feel "less guilty"....

You don't care about reciprocity (so much) if you feel that you have "wronged" your partner in some terrible manner in the past.

What did we do wrong? I means besides let 135K American soldiers die in the European Theater.

[Stormaktstiden]

America staunchly defends Israel because of how profoundly Jewish influence inside the United States affects our politics. We have no strategic or economic interests in proportion to their influence over our policies. China demonstrably has a much more profound effect on our National Security and our economic stability and they do not have anywhere near the influence Israel has over us, matter of fact in most matters they directly oppose us. Great Britain is a longer and much more trusted allie, yet even they have nowhere near the inexplicable influence over our politics.

Therefore since there are no strategic, economic, or even geographic answers that are sufficient to explain the question, the answer must by elimination be political.

Anyone that criticizes President Obama is ignorant of the factual circumstance. For example, the United Nations has passed more resolutions condeming Israeli aggression than it has all other countries combined http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Un ... ing_Israel. Israel is in direction violation of interational law or more precisely Chapter VII of the United Nations Charter which empowers the UN to "determine the existence of any threat to the peace, breach of the peace, or act of aggression" and to take military and nonmilitary action to "restore international peace and security" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapter_VI ... ns_Charter.


Has Israel so completely polluted the media and our politics that simply asking them to comply with international law is an affrot to them? To the point that our own President is publicly chastised by these conniving beggars?

[BigRedMan]

Here is who really runs the world. End of debate. Next topic.

[youtube]TPMS6tGOACo[/youtube]

[innocentbystander]

exerpt from eCat rant. Was hoping someone would answer this question.

http://www.goatpen.net/viewtopic.php?f= ... =740#p5635

It is not that it serves America's goals so much as (helping Israel) makes Americans who feel "gulity" are free to feel "less guilty"....

You don't care about reciprocity (so much) if you feel that you have "wronged" your partner in some terrible manner in the past.

What did we do wrong?

I don't think we did anything wrong (as I don't feel guilty.) But you would not be asking that question if you actually clicked on the link and read the post I wrote. Go back and read it.

[innocentbystander]

America staunchly defends Israel because of how profoundly Jewish influence inside the United States affects our politics. We have no strategic or economic interests in proportion to their influence over our policies. China demonstrably has a much more profound effect on our National Security and our economic stability and they do not have anywhere near the influence Israel has over us, matter of fact in most matters they directly oppose us. Great Britain is a longer and much more trusted allie, yet even they have nowhere near the inexplicable influence over our politics.

Therefore since there are no strategic, economic, or even geographic answers that are sufficient to explain the question, the answer must by elimination be political.

Anyone that criticizes President Obama is ignorant of the factual circumstance. For example, the United Nations has passed more resolutions condeming Israeli aggression than it has all other countries combined http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Un ... ing_Israel. Israel is in direction violation of interational law or more precisely Chapter VII of the United Nations Charter which empowers the UN to "determine the existence of any threat to the peace, breach of the peace, or act of aggression" and to take military and nonmilitary action to "restore international peace and security" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapter_VI ... ns_Charter.


Has Israel so completely polluted the media and our politics that simply asking them to comply with international law is an affront to them? To the point that our own President is publicly chastised by these conniving beggars?

It is not so much that they have polluted our media as it is what they have done to the Democratic Party. Let me ask you, do you (or really do ANY of you) have a problem with Judaism having its own country (that they share with Muslims) that is less than the size of New Jersey? If not, why would any of you want them to give up even one more inch of their sovereign land?

And before you go off all half-cocked at the answer I gave your question, let me rephrase your question for just a moment (tap into your own feeling of "guilt") and then try to answer this one honestly:

Has Mexico so completely polluted the media and our politics that simply asking illegal aliens to comply with US Federal law is an affront to them? To the point that our own President is publicly chastised by these conniving beggars?

Because if you are going to come down on the Israelis (for what? not wanting to be rocket attacked every day by animals living in Gaza) try and be consistent. And remember, because none of us have ever seen our home in smoldering ruin as a result of a Cherokee or Apache firing a rocket from the safety of the casino rooftop on their sovereign land, we couldn't possibly understand what it is like to live in Israel.

[Dora]

It is not so much that they have polluted our media as it is what they have done to the Democratic Party.

What have they done to the Democratic Party?

[innocentbystander]

It is not so much that they have polluted our media as it is what they have done to the Democratic Party.

What have they done to the Democratic Party?

AIPAC gives millions to the re-election campaign warchests for Democrats in some of the more hotly contested districts. How do you think the real life liberal Democrat Charlie Wilson (from Charlie Wilson's War) kept getting re-elected every two years in the second Congressional district in Texas of all places?

Those Congressional Democrats are then beholden to Israel because of the money they get from AIPAC. But still, the root of the support in this country for Israel, mostly stems from irrational "guilt."