Florida State Seminoles

[AlabamAlum]

The last true non-evangelical that we had in Austin was Ann Richards, and she had an affinity for the drink, which wouldn't be bad if you didn't also include her affinity for drinking and driving.

Hey, it worked for the Kennedy's.

[eCat]

interesting situation may arise in the media soon.


Drone attacks killed Al-Alawki - a big time Al Qaeda terrorist responsible for inciting many English speaking Muslims into converting.

Couldn't happen to a nicer guy right? The problem is this guy is an American citizen.

So technically , while he is an enemy combatant, we targeted an American citizen for termination.

I just wonder how many in the media are going to catch that. I bet even Ron Paul hopes he doesn't have to defend this guys constitutional rights.

[Saint]

"So technically , while he is an enemy combatant, we targeted an American citizen for termination."

you say this like it's unprecedented

[Saint]

the 2nd US citizen killed in that raid, Samir Khan, a 24-year-old who grew up in Charlotte where he once ran an al Quaida website from his parents house.

[eCat]

"So technically , while he is an enemy combatant, we targeted an American citizen for termination."

you say this like it's unprecedented

isn't it? I didn't realize it had happened before

[Saint]

I would be extremely surprised if it hadn't, esp. during the civil war. besides, these 2 pretty much decided they were at war vs. the USA, so civil liberties go out the window when you take up with a sworn enemy. at least that's how I see it.

[eCat]

I would be extremely surprised if it hadn't, esp. during the civil war. besides, these 2 pretty much decided they were at war vs. the USA, so civil liberties go out the window when you take up with a sworn enemy. at least that's how I see it.

oh I thought you meant recently. Read the story on the Bonus Army - that will really piss you off. MacArthur and Patton running down WWI veterans on public lands.

Yes, I'm not sure what the rules are if you are an enemy combatant but the concern is you aren't afforded due process and are targeted for death - not as a peripheral or collateral damage - but you are the *target* - then what is to stop them from doing that to someone on American soil?

The guy who was planning on blowing up the bridge here or a car bomb in time square. American citizens start showing up with bullet holes in their temple is a bit disconcerting for me.

We are one or two incidents away from having armed drones flying over US soil.

[eCat]

well he did it anyways. Yet another situation where he is probably right but his views will cost him votes

"Paul, a Texas congressman known for libertarian views, says the killing of Anwar al-Awlaki on Yemeni soil amounts to an "assassination." Paul warned the American people not to casually accept such violence against U.S. citizens, even those with strong ties to terrorism.

Anwar al-Awlaki was considered one of the most influential al-Qaida operatives wanted by the United States. U.S. and Yemen officials say he was killed in a U.S. air strike targeting his convoy Friday morning.

Paul made the comments to reporters after a campaign stop Friday at Saint Anselm College in New Hampshire. He said America's leaders must think hard about "assassinating American citizens without charges
"

[AlabamAlum]

I would think leaving your country to head a group of armed insurgents intent on bringing war, death, destruction (whatever) to your (former) country would be enough to have your citizenship revoked. If it's not, it should be, imo.

[eCat]

I would think leaving your country to head a group of armed insurgents intent on bringing war, death, destruction (whatever) to your (former) country would be enough to have your citizenship revoked. If it's not, it should be, imo.

our fore fathers were armed insurgents at one time - I suspect that played a big role in them creating the 5th amendment.

I'm not defending the guy - clearly he is accountable for treason or something of that magnitude, but the guy is still an American citizen.

If I vehemently defend the rights of the first and second amendment in absolutes, I'm not certain I can skip over the 5th if the guy isn't on the battlefield, resides in a country we are not at war with, and as so far as I know hasn't taken up arms against Americans.

[Jungle Rat]

Fuck him. He's a traitor. Traitors die.

Obviously eCat doesn't watch NCIS. They shoot Americans all the time for trying to blow government shit up.

[AlabamAlum]

I support the 5th A. However, when you leave your country and take up arms against her, you have in an a very overt way, renounced your citizenship, IMO.

If we ever get to a point where we hesitate to take one of them out, I would imagine that al Qaida would have attach one US citizen in every terror cell.

[eCat]

Al Qaeda's tactics shouldn't be relevant to honoring Americans constitutional rights

if he renounced his citizenship, if his citizenship was taken away - then too bad , so sad

If they had just told us Yemeni killed these guys, then on one cares...good riddance

[AlabamAlum]

He did renounce his citizenship.

[Owlman]

However, when you leave your country and take up arms against her, you have in an a very overt way, renounced your citizenship, IMO.

I don't think this is the case. You have committed treason however. I don't think it would have been too hard to get a trial in abstentia on him. I need to look up the whole legality of Wanted Dead of Alive posters.

[AlabamAlum]

Spacer,

Well, I ended it with an "in my opinion" - I'm saying if that's not current law, it should be. Surely, it is reasonable to revoke the citizenship of someone who leaves their country and takes up arms and orchestrates attacks?

He had dual Yemeni-US citizenship. Al-Awlaki left the US, went to Yemen at the age of 8 and became involved in al-Qaida operations to wage war on the US.

Obama put him on this CIA kill list last year and I support his decision.

[AlabamAlum]

Here's a couple of follow up questions, spacer:

(1) If Obama wrongly (illegally?) put a US citizen on the kill list, should Obama be charged with a crime? Should there be any punishment or censure for this?

(2) Are there any actions committed by a US citizen which will cause his citizenship to be revoked? If I denounce the US, move out of the country, encourage and recruit attacks on the US, build a nuclear bomb and send it FedEx to the White House, etc, can my citizenship be revoked?

[crashcourse]

nope

legally I would think even if you renounce your citizenship you could go back and claim you have a constitutional right for whatever you want that particular moment

as far as I know only if you are tried under UCMJ military--or under a foreign governemnt or world court do you lose a lot/all of your constitutional rights.

[Jungle Rat]

Glad he's dead.

[Owlman]

Spacer,

Well, I ended it with an "in my opinion" - I'm saying if that's not current law, it should be. Surely, it is reasonable to revoke the citizenship of someone who leaves their country and takes up arms and orchestrates attacks?

He had dual Yemeni-US citizenship. Al-Awlaki left the US, went to Yemen at the age of 8 and became involved in al-Qaida operations to wage war on the US.

Obama put him on this CIA kill list last year and I support his decision.

Actually, I wasn't sure. I should have said, I don't think that is the case, but I am not sure. I spoke to a former Asst Attorney General about this. We've alleged that American citizens were enemy combatants since the Civil War. There are specific ways to renounce your citizenship. Whether or not Al-Awlaki did this to satisfy the law, I dont' know. Either way, as a treasoness American citizen or an ex-American citizen who declared war on the U.S., classifying him as an enemy combatant is probably okay. And in an active war footing, one doesn't need to get a court order when an enemy combatant is in your sights.