Florida State Seminoles

[hedge]

I guess you don't know the difference b/w a public health emergency and a general national emergency...

[Jungle Rat]

Hedge. Don't confuse these idiots with the facts. Their dementia riddled brains can't handle it.

[Professor Tiger]

I guess you don't know the difference b/w a public health emergency and a general national emergency...

Nice try. But let’s have a little fun. Let’s accept your pathetic argument and just compare Trump’s timeline vs Obama’s.

Obama waited 178 days after WHO declared a Public Health Concern of Intetnational Concern before he declared a national emergency. That is a fact, no matter what you are reading in the news section of High Times magazine.

Let’s compare that to Trump’s timeline:

1 January 2020
The World Health Organization announced that it would hold an emergency meeting on the virus the following day to determine if the virus is a "public health emergency of international concern (PHEIC)".[373]

13 March 2020
U.S. President Donald Trump declared a national state of emergency, allocating about US$50 billion of U.S. federal government money for relief efforts.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timelin ... March_2020

#days between WHO declared a public health emergency of national concern and US President declares national emergency:

Obama: 178
Trump: 43

Trump was doing his job and Obama was playing golf. Next;

By the time Obama finally declared a national emergency on October 24, this is how far he had let it get out of hand:

September 3
The CDC in its Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report[387] notes that 67% of thirty-six children who have died from H1N1 early in the epidemic had at least one serious chronic medical condition, with neurodevelopmental conditions such as developmental delay, epilepsy, and cerebral palsy being especially prominent.[388] Roughly one in thirteen deaths have been of school-age children. More than 80% of the children who died were five or older, in contrast with the seasonal flu baseline of half or more of the influenza fatalities being four or younger.

September 12
CDC FluView Week 36: Influenza activity continues to increase with widespread influenza activity in twenty-one states, regional influenza activity in nine. Seven of ten HHS Surveillance Regions report ILI activity above region-specific baselines. "99% of all subtyped influenza A viruses being reported to CDC were 2009 influenza A (H1N1) viruses."[405]

September 25
Forty-two schools are closed in eight states as the second wave of the pandemic begins in early autumn.

September 30
46 states and Washington, D.C. begin ordering what becomes by the next day a cumulative total of 1,378,200 doses of the nasal-spray Live Attenuated Influenza Vaccine (LAIV)[427] for H1N1. N[

October 3
CDC FluView Week 39: The proportion of deaths attributed to pneumonia and influenza (P&I) reaches the epidemic threshold with eight out of ten HHS ILI regions reporting region-specific ILI activity above region-specific baseline levels. Widespread influenza activity in thirty-seven states, regional activity in 11.

October 10
CDC FluView Week 40: The proportion of deaths attributed to pneumonia and influenza (P&I) is officially above the epidemic threshold. Moreover, for the first time all 10 HHS ILI regions reported ILI above region-specific baseline levels. Widespread influenza activity in forty-one states, and regional activity in eight, with only one state—Hawaii—reporting local influenza activity.

October 16
An initial shortfall of swine flu vaccine is predicted shortly after the proportion of deaths attributed to pneumonia and influenza goes above the epidemic threshold[444] in some states,[445] with flu activity widespread in 41 states.[446] It is also announced that the number cases, hospitalizations and deaths are unprecedented for this time of year, with flu-like illnesses accounting for 6.1% of all doctor visits, itself an unusually high number.

Let’s compare that to today. A week after a Trump declared a national emergency, the coronavirus in the US has 5,712 cases and 102 deaths.

Unlike Obama, Trump declared a national emergency before the pandemic situation got completely out of hand. Under Obama swine flu did get out of hand. According to that Russian troll farm, the CDC:

“From April 12, 2009 to April 10, 2010, CDC estimated there were 60.8 million cases (range: 43.3-89.3 million), 274,304 hospitalizations (range: 195,086-402,719), and 12,469 deaths (range: 8868-18,306) in the United States due to the (H1N1)pdm09 virus.”

What did Obama do to stop swine flu? This is what Trump has done to stop coronavirus.

11 March
U.S. President Donald Trump announced that all travel from Europe (except UK) into the United States will be suspended for 30 days.[749]

16 March
Trump announces federal guidelines, including closing schools and public spaces, stopping nursing home visits, no gatherings of more than 10 people, fed just cut the interest rate to near zero, military turning over
5 million respirator masks, turning Walmart parking lots into triage areas, everybody’s about to get a $1,000 check, etc.

Which of these robust measures did Obama do against swine flu?

[Jungle Rat]

I'm sure that you will be refusing to accept that 1k though. Being adamantly against socialism and all right?

[Professor Tiger]

Nice deflection.

[eCat]

if we do get $1K, I am going to make sure it all goes back into our local economy- specifically mom n pop restaurants.

[Jungle Rat]

Nice deflection.

You're the pro. Didn't answer it though which is typical of a Trumpette.

[hedge]

Obama was in the middle of trying to avert the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression when swine flu hit. He declared a public health emergency when there were only 20 known cases in the US. Trump was still sucking off of Obama's great economy (and, naturally, trying to take sole credit for it), when coronavirus hit, he did everything he could to downplay it b/c he knew it would affect the economy and, even more important to him, the stock market. There is no comparison. Trump is a retard who doesn't even comprehend what's going on, ever. He cut the NSC pandemic team in half (drain the swamp!), which only had 400 people to start with. Woo boy, way to trim the fat. Not saying that if he hadn't done that, everything would be fine now, it wouldn't, but it just goes to show he's more than willing to gamble with the health and lives of American citizens...

[hedge]

"It was two years ago when Trump ordered the shutdown of the White House National Security Council's entire global health security unit. NBC News had a good report on this recently, noting that the president's decision "to downsize the White House national security staff -- and eliminate jobs addressing global pandemics -- is likely to hamper the U.S. government's response to the coronavirus."

It was against this backdrop that a reporter asked Trump late last week about whether he was prepared to "rethink having an Office of Pandemic Preparation in the White House." The president replied:

"I just think this is something, Peter, that you can never really think is going to happen. You know, who -- I've heard all about, 'This could be...' -- you know, 'This could be a big deal,' from before it happened. You know, this -- something like this could happen.... Who would have thought? Look, how long ago is it? Six, seven, eight weeks ago -- who would have thought we would even be having the subject? ... You never really know when something like this is going to strike and what it's going to be."

It's worth emphasizing that this is Trump's second explanation related to his decision to disband his global health security team. "I'm a business person," he explained two weeks ago in response to a similar question. "I don't like having thousands of people around when you don't need them. When we need them, we can get them back very quickly.""

[hedge]

"As it turns out, the administration cannot actually reassemble such a team "very quickly," though Trump, still unfamiliar with how much of the executive branch works, may not have known that.

It set the stage for this new argument: Trump dissolved the White House's pandemic team because he had no idea he might need a pandemic team.

Except, that's not an especially satisfying answer. The whole point of having a team focused on epidemiological threats is (a) viral outbreaks can happen; (b) one never knows when they'll happen; and (c) countries want to be prepared when they do happen.

According to the president, "you can never really think is going to happen," but the National Security Council's team existed precisely because officials recognized the possible hazard. Indeed, as the New York Times noted overnight that President Barack Obama established the Directorate for Global Health Security and Biodefense at the National Security Council after the 2014 Ebola outbreak, making clear that some folks were acutely aware of possibilities like these.

It's as if the president is unfamiliar with the idea of insurance on a conceptual level."

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-sho ... m-n1153221

[bluetick]

12,000 died with swine flu between April 2009 and April 2010. Those are typical flu mortality numbers, to wit:

CDC estimates that influenza has resulted in between 9 million – 45 million illnesses, between 140,000 – 810,000 hospitalizations and between 12,000 – 61,000 deaths annually since 2010.

It was known 6 weeks ago that COVID-19 was AT LEAST 10x more deadly than flu and spread at a much higher rate. This was before comments like "dem hoax, gone by April, go to work and get better, 15 to zero, it'll wash out" etc etc. We could have had WHO-approved test kits - millions of them - weeks ago. ALL of these federal pronouncements could have come precious days earlier.

12,000 died with swine flu - authorities would take that as a monthly total for this thing and not blink. Former head of the CDC says we will likely see a million dead.

[bluetick]

Trump Now Claims He Always Knew the Coronavirus Would Be a Pandemic
The president tried to rewrite his history with advising Americans about the coronavirus. His own words prove him wrong.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/17/us/p ... virus.html

[aTm]

Based on this thread....it would seem the politics are apparently a much more important and bigger issue than actual health issues related to coronavirus are.

[Jungle Rat]

Yep

[Jungle Rat]

https://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2020/ ... VHOyRLUJr0

[eCat]

its crazy how much my position has shifted in 5 days

even if I didn't change, the decision was made for me. I saw a live cam of bourbon street - it was empty, times square pretty much the same. The only place that isn't is the Florida beaches. I can't believe the Florida Gov hasn't put a stop to that.

I had hotel reservations at a few places as we were going to make a loop around the south. I also had airline tickets for my wife to meet me.

not that I should get it, but 1 hotel refused to give me a refund on a guaranteed rate, and it appears American Airlines is not going to give me credit for a future flight. Delta gave me credit on a future flight and 3 other hotels either gave me a refund or allowed me to cancel without penalty.

[eCat]

When I got into management at work, I learned there were things I had to say to the employees that I didn't necessarily believe in order to support the company position, compliance or the greater good.

And that was for 20 college graduates

Whether Trump's actions or words were the best response, he had to say things that were an attempt to keep the country calm, keep our economy going and to buy him and the rest of our government time.

Even with his attempts to down play it, you had people lining up 2 hours before opening at Costco to buy toilet paper, cleaning out meat sections of grocery stores and wrapped around the block to buy guns.

To call Trump out for his attempts to keep the country from going into chaos is I believe misguided and self serving.

Of course, if Obama had to deal with an emergency like this, people would have called him out as well. Its just the nature of politics. But you need to at least understand why he did and is doing what he did.

[Toemeesleather]

Lessee, where have we seen this MO before....oh yeah, Trump put kids in cages!!!!!! but not Obammer, right.

[crotch]

Whether Trump's actions or words were the best response, he had to say things that were an attempt to keep the country calm, keep our economy going and to buy him and the rest of our government time.

To call Trump out for his attempts to keep the country from going into chaos is I believe misguided and self serving.

Exactly..... good post e

[hedge]

"Based on this thread....it would seem the politics are apparently a much more important and bigger issue than actual health issues related to coronavirus are."

Well, this is the politics thread...