Florida State Seminoles

[eCat]

Pay your bills? For who? Every person in America owes $46K on the national debt and Washington wants to raise the debt ceiling so that number can grow more.

I don't blame anyone for saying no thanks. While I agree they probably don't understand that defaulting would result in higher interest rates which in turn would increase our debt, Washington politicians from both sides aren't willing to make guarantees that will prevent us from being in this same situation again down the road.

[Owlman]

Pay your bills? For who? Every person in America owes $46K on the national debt and Washington wants to raise the debt ceiling so that number can grow more.

I don't blame anyone for saying no thanks. While I agree they probably don't understand that defaulting would result in higher interest rates which in turn would increase our debt, Washington politicians from both sides aren't willing to make guarantees that will prevent us from being in this same situation again down the road.

You should blame them. If you don't increase the debt ceiling then the amount people owe goes up based on interest payments. Take that 46K to 100K all due to interest. You decrease your debt by changing your budget not by threatening not to pay what you already owe.

[Owlman]

One of the things that just galls me is the Christian fundamentalist who would give talks and lectures about bankruptcy being against Christian principals, how many of them in their success stories would proudly proclaim how they didn't give in to bankruptcy and paid all their debts.

I spoke to a number of them last week and they don't see this as the same.

[eCat]

Pay your bills? For who? Every person in America owes $46K on the national debt and Washington wants to raise the debt ceiling so that number can grow more.

I don't blame anyone for saying no thanks. While I agree they probably don't understand that defaulting would result in higher interest rates which in turn would increase our debt, Washington politicians from both sides aren't willing to make guarantees that will prevent us from being in this same situation again down the road.

You should blame them. If you don't increase the debt ceiling then the amount people owe goes up based on interest payments. Take that 46K to 100K all due to interest. You decrease your debt by changing your budget not by threatening not to pay what you already owe.

but the model we are in now is government agrees to the spending, then demands that the debt ceiling be raised to support with threats of default and financial collapse. Its extortion.

Even now, democrats refuse to adopt a mentality where our spending must be capped, nor will Washington as a whole subscribe to a balanced budget.

I am also outraged at those who talk of personal responsibility yet believe they have no connection to the mess we are in for supporting government spending on wars and entitlements.

[aTm]

One of the things that just galls me is the Christian fundamentalist.

Fixed your post.

[Owlman]

The balanced budget amendment is probably the largest of stupid ideas that has ever been proposed. We would not have won WWI or WWII with that amendment. The only time this country was out of debt was under Jackson and it led to one of the biggest downturns in economies immediately after leaving office.

Quit using gimmicks. Make a long term plan, be willing to come off of your treasured things. That means do something longterm with entitlement Democrats and quit assuming that the word tax is equivalent with the devil Republicans. But do it in the budget, not with refusing to pay the debt we already owe.

[eCat]

we're not in a world war

every balanced budget amendment would have some emergency contingency

[Saint]

the gov't is not the problem for everyday Americans. it's the high cost of living. part of me just wants these right-wing fools to completely get their way so we can all see how quickly this place would fall apart. but then, most of those nimrods would still defend their philosophy

[Owlman]

businesses in trouble do not get out of that trouble by getting rid of their ability to borrow. They negotiate a change in their loans, or extend them while changing their business plan.

[Owlman]

Want a balanced budget amendment, pass it separate from the debt ceiling

[Owlman]

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/john ... 36239.html

How do you post the actual video?

<iframe src="http://videos.mediaite.com/embed/player ... pe_cid=svp" width="420" height="421" frameborder="0" marginheight="0" marginwidth="0" scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true"></iframe>

[eCat]

businesses in trouble do not get out of that trouble by getting rid of their ability to borrow. They negotiate a change in their loans, or extend them while changing their business plan.

we're not a business

we print the money - and the people in charge cannot be trusted to make good decisions with that power.

[Owlman]

The problem with politicians is not that they make the decisions that their constituents want who aren't very tolerant of sacrifices. Listen to most people who want cuts, they mostly list things that other people get. Very few list things that they get, such as deductions for homeownership, school loans to the middle and upper class, money to states for roads etc.

[Bklyn]

Didn't realize the particulars of this case (if everything said here is accurate)

Beginning in early December, President Bush, vice-president Dick Cheney, members of the cabinet and other officials then embarked on a series of truly extraordinary public statements about John, referring to him repeatedly as an "al-Qaida fighter", a terrorist and a traitor. I think it fair to say there has never been a case quite like this in the history of the US, in which officials at the highest levels of the government made such prejudicial statements about an individual citizen who had not yet been charged with any crime.

I will offer only a small sample of these statements. In an interview at the White House on 21 December 2001, President Bush said John was "the first American al-Qaida fighter that we have captured". Donald Rumsfeld, secretary of defence, told reporters at a press briefing that John had been "captured by US forces with an AK-47 in his hands". Colin Powell, secretary of state, said John had "brought shame upon his family". Rudy Giuliani, New York mayor, remarked: "I believe the death penalty is the appropriate remedy to consider."

John Ashcroft, the US attorney general, staged two televised press conferences in which he accused John of attacking the US. "Americans who love their country do not dedicate themselves to killing Americans," he declared.

A federal judge took the unusual step of writing to the New York Times criticising the attorney general for violating "Justice Department guidelines on the release of information related to criminal proceedings that are intended to ensure that a defendant is not prejudiced when such an announcement is made".

Even the ultra-conservative National Review thought Ashcroft had gone too far in making such prejudicial comments about a pending prosecution. It criticised the comments as "inappropriate" and "gratuitous", stating that in the future "it would be better for the attorney general simply to announce the facts of the indictments, and to avoid extra comments which might unintentionally imperil successful prosecutions".

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/ju ... ban-father

[Jungle Rat]

Bush lied, American soldiers today still die.

[sardis]

Someone tell me why we need to legislate higher taxes when, under current law, the Clinton era tax rates kick back in at the end of 2012? The Dems want to go higher than that? The reason for Clinton's budget surplus was in small part the higher rates, but in large part because spending was only 18-19% of GDP and currently it is 25% of GDP. You HAVE to cut spending, the higher revenue is already automatic.

[eCat]

what I think is going to happen is that the Boehner plan will die because the Tea Party branch will not relent (although Allen West has) and then the republicans will be faced with the democratic plan as the only viable option between now and Aug 2, which they will cave under and which is what Boehner and the other RINO's wanted all along but couldn't commit to because of the tea party branch and the strong base of voters demanding no tax increases.

Then they'll all talk about how this insures a stronger America and will reach out to Standard and Poor to keep the credit rating in tact.

[eCat]

This is the email I got from the tea party

Code: Select all

Dear ...........,

Multiple sources reported yesterday that House Speaker John Boehner told Republican representatives to “get your a-- in line” and support his debt ceiling compromise during a meeting on Wednesday.

Why is the GOP leadership scrambling for support? Because they know the American people are outraged at yet another surrender and are putting historic pressure on Republican members to reject any business as usual proposal that will keep our country running full steam ahead toward economic disaster.

I hope you contact your representative today with one simple message. When threatened to “get in line” to support the statist quo and presented with the leadership’s plan today, tell them to just say “no.”

No to phony deals.

No to more debt.

No to more runaway spending.

No to selling out our futures so they can make an unpopular, desperate president happy.

To try to pacify those who actually want to solve our nation’s problems, the leadership put together a plan that the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) estimates will reduce the deficit by $917 billion.

Over the next ten years.

Meanwhile, they’ll let the President have a $900 billion increase in the debt ceiling – right away.

But wait! The leadership is bragging that their plan will reduce the Fiscal Year 2012 budget deficit by a whole $22 billion – in what’s expected to be an over $1 trillion deficit.

That is, frankly, insulting.

You know how you convince people to “get in line”?

You lead.

Real leadership wouldn’t require a panicked scramble that involves cursing at the people you courted to get power less than a year ago.

Real leadership wouldn’t require threatening your fellow members of Congress.

Real leadership during this economic crisis would inspire the American people, who would take care of putting the pressure on their elected officials because they would see that you were willing to fight for legitimate change.

Real leadership would follow Senator Rand Paul’s example by calling for at least $500 billion in cuts this year and an immediate, fundamental change in how government operates.

I don’t know about you, but I’ve had enough of being told I’m “extreme” because I think it’s fiscally responsible to drastically cut spending when we’re trillions of dollars in debt.

So, please, join me in contacting Congress to urge our representatives to oppose the House Republican Leadership’s so-called “plan.”

Over half a million Americans have “gotten in line” with the freedom message by joining Campaign for Liberty because they know we are fighting for solutions – not surrender.

If the House Republican Leadership expects people to join them, then they should start trying to give people something worth following.

[Owlman]

No agreement, a plan will pass with 1trillion or less in cuts with no tax increases, the U.S. will be downgraded, members of the House and Senate, Republican and Democrats will gripe at the rating agencies and finally look at their primary participation in causing the economic downturn, Obama will express support for this and then the Congressional tea-partiers will then say Obama is anti-business and now be against another thing Obama says he's for that once was supported by Republicans.

[DooKSucks]

No agreement, a plan will pass with 1trillion or less in cuts with no tax increases, the U.S. will be downgraded, members of the House and Senate, Republican and Democrats will gripe at the rating agencies and finally look at their primary participation in causing the economic downturn, Obama will express support for this and then the Congressional tea-partiers will then say Obama is anti-business and now be against another thing Obama says he's for that once was supported by Republicans.

The credit rating agencies are already under investigation. It's not public knowledge, but I know of one northern state's AG office that is conducting an investigation because a law school classmate with whom I talk weekly is involved. This person hinted at the possibility of quiet federal involvement.