Florida State Seminoles

[eCat]

he talks about it in the interview

[Bklyn]

OK. Won't get to it until tonight probably. I'll try to remember to access the link.

[eCat]

On Sunday, January 26th ,the former NSA contractor, whistleblower, and US fugitive, Edward Snowden gave a candid 30 minute interview for the German television network ARD. The problem with this interview is that in America there was zero mainstream media coverage via the web, television, or print. This story appears to have gone ‘radio silent’, and something about that doesn’t quite add up, as it is shocking this day and age, to perform any Google search and not be able to find any information on this interview from anyone other than blogs, and the Guardian.

Snowden’s discussion was filmed in an undisclosed location in Russia and was his first time interviewing with a major television network. In the video, Snowden chronicled the aftermath of his revelations that were provided to major media outlets like the Washington Post and New York Times.

Recently, President Obama called for Edward Snowden to return to the US and asked him to ‘make his case’ in the courts. In his interview Edward Snowden spoke directly to this request, as in the minds of most Americans this seems to be a reasonable action to take if you have done nothing wrong.

“What [the president] doesn’t say is that the crimes that he’s charged me with are crimes that don’t allow me to make my case. They don’t allow me to defend myself in an open court, to the public, and convince a jury that what I did was to their benefit. The Espionage Act… it’s from 1918, was never intended to prosecute journalistic sources, people who are informing the newspapers about information that is in the public interest.”

President Obama also recently has spoken about changes needing to be made in the data collection protocol, including the creation of a public interest advocate. These changes lend credence to Edward Snowden being more a whistleblower than spy, as he exposed to the public the mismanagement, corruption, illegality, and overall wrongdoing of the NSA. The changes made by Obama prove that the NSA activities were less than legal, or else the President would have just come out and defended as well as justified the programs existence instead of modifying it and promising future modifications. The revelations by Snowden have even surprised members of both parties in Congress, who are now calling for more oversight of the NSA. This comes about because of the current lack of oversight of the program and the potentially illegal activities taking place with this surveillance program due to the lack of oversight and transparency.

http://www.modvive.com/2014/02/03/edwar ... can-media/

[Owlman]

[youtube]FORtwA2lsjM[/youtube]

another person's view.

A Former CIA Whistleblower Has Some Harsh Words For Edward Snowden

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/former-ci ... 47583.html

[eCat]

he's bitter because he went to jail.

[Jungle Rat]

Bring him home. I'm tired of all this covert bullshit. This man exposed the Watergate of our time. Except this one went much longer & was covered up much better. Just another Bush problem passed on.

[Bklyn]

I'll wait til I see the interview, but this was not Watergate. I separate the Snowden items into two buckets. One bucket is he exposed what many have known since 2003. The Patriot Act is all up in your shit. We let it happen because we were afraid of falling planes and things Jack Bauer couldn't stop. Snowden told me nothing I did not know, with regard to NSA snooping. Nothing.

The other bucket is the information passed regarding monitoring of foreign governments and locations of covert data mining sites in foreign countries. That was outside of any whistleblowing activity. That was endangering US Intelligence assets. Snowden was not protecting any of our Constitutional protections.

I do find it funny that bitches on the Hill let the Patriot Act come into existence out of fear of terrorism and sat silent on the most dubious items so not to be seen as "weak on terror." I think Ron (or maybe Rand...or both) was one of the few who had balls enough then to tell everyone what would happen with the NSA having unchecked power (maybe Bernie Sanders, too). Now the collective public has their head out their ass and Snowden is offering "revelations." Whatever.

Anyway, my beef is on the information on foreign intel. Not cool.

I will watch the link tonight, so my feelings may change. Until then, that's my position

[eCat]

what he exposed is way beyond Patriot Act and I've probably been the most vocal against the patriot act as anyone on here.

The NSA is redefining what spying is, just as Bush redefined torture. They differentiate between collecting terabytes of data on millions of people and actually focusing on a single person so they think its OK to actually have the data, as long as its non specific to who is collected - and then they determine thru the data, who should be targeted. They pre-emptively track you based on your internet habits, phone calls and travel. Everyone is a potential terrorist in the eyes of the NSA.

[Bklyn]

To me, I always viewed that as being precipitated by the Patriot Act coming into play freeing the NSA from oversight of the FISA courts. The Patriot Act was not a defining law, it was delimiting law. It opened up the possibilities, so the actions of the NSA and HLS that came afterwards were a consequence of the Act's tilting of power from the people more to the state.

Even with all that said (i.e. if the NSA overstepped the provisions contained in the Patriot Act), that doesn't matter to my central position. Edward Snowden is a traitor because he put national intelligence assets at risk in an exercise that did not protect the Constitutional rights of any American citizen.

I'm still at work, so I'm getting a bit ahead of myself. Maybe Snowden will say something in that link that he hasn't in the past regarding his global espionage leaks and it will get me to change my position. So far? Nope. Traitor.

[Bklyn]

what he exposed is way beyond Patriot Act and I've probably been the most vocal against the patriot act as anyone on here.

Also, I know you have been. I think a lot of people have been. I'm talking about the bitch ass corporate teet suckers on the Hill masquerading as public servants not having any balls.

[eCat]

To me, I always viewed that as being precipitated by the Patriot Act coming into play freeing the NSA from oversight of the FISA courts. The Patriot Act was not a defining law, it was delimiting law. It opened up the possibilities, so the actions of the NSA and HLS that came afterwards were a consequence of the Act's tilting of power from the people more to the state.

Even with all that said (i.e. if the NSA overstepped the provisions contained in the Patriot Act), that doesn't matter to my central position. Edward Snowden is a traitor because he put national intelligence assets at risk in an exercise that did not protect the Constitutional rights of any American citizen.

I'm still at work, so I'm getting a bit ahead of myself. Maybe Snowden will say something in that link that he hasn't in the past regarding his global espionage leaks and it will get me to change my position. So far? Nope. Traitor.

I think you have to ask yourself what is the role of our government first and then decide if he is a traitor. While you rail against the patriot act, I'm not sure you're taking in the context of just how much liberty Americans have given up in the name of security.

[Saint]

I seem to recall many of them willingly giving it up in 2003 or whenever the PA was enacted. Now some of those folks (not eCat) are griping about it because their guy isn't in the Oval Office.

[Jungle Rat]

I think I just pooped in someones bucket.

[Owlman]

What does spying on the German chancellor have to do with the civil liberties of Ameicans???

[BigRedMan]

Don't start none, won't be none.

I could care less if the NSA spies on me. At most they will find downloaded movies and some Christy Mack porn. Other than that, I am not trying to build a bomb, make meth, or start a revolution.

And if they used the information to feed to local police about Billy Bob and his friends having a lot of chatter about meth and they do their detective work to find out they had a big ole meth lab and were able to shut it down before someone got blown up or hurt, I am find with that.

And I am all about responsible gun ownership. If you think they are monitoring people that own a dozen or so guns and talk about stocking up on ammo, probably not so much. They couldn't care less unless they see words like shooting rampage or going to kill my wife, shit like that.

Just my .02.

[sardis]

What does spying on the German Chancellor have anything to do with national security?

[eCat]

the case against Edward Snowden is coming from the Government, the same government that wouldn't admit they were spying on you in the first place

I'm not inclined to give our government the benefit of the doubt. They'll *tell* you whatever they do is in the benefit of national security - its the perfect firewall to stop the American people from demanding transparency.

But we all know better. Honestly I'm more than a little surprised at the amount of trust shown in our government on here as it is.

[eCat]

Don't start none, won't be none.

I could care less if the NSA spies on me. At most they will find downloaded movies and some Christy Mack porn. Other than that, I am not trying to build a bomb, make meth, or start a revolution.

And if they used the information to feed to local police about Billy Bob and his friends having a lot of chatter about meth and they do their detective work to find out they had a big ole meth lab and were able to shut it down before someone got blown up or hurt, I am find with that.

And I am all about responsible gun ownership. If you think they are monitoring people that own a dozen or so guns and talk about stocking up on ammo, probably not so much. They couldn't care less unless they see words like shooting rampage or going to kill my wife, shit like that.

Just my .02.

until the next election when some evangelical decides that Christy Mack porn is indecent and has a minimum jail sentence of 90 days in jail, and that downloaded movies are in violation of the DMCA and its a $3500 fine for all known offenders for each offense. Then you won't be so happy about the NSA snooping in your shit without justification.

This inherit trust that our government is only going to do the right thing and therefore giving up a few freedoms is ok in the name of security is exactly what they want you think. Its carte blanche for a career in spying with a blank check.

This isn't about terrorism, its about the NSA tracking a shitload of information about you in case they ever decide they *need* to investigate your ass. Of course it won't be the NSA, it will be the FBI knocking your door, or the DEA, BATF, ICE, CIA - whatever acronym the NSA serves the information too in the name of American security.

You're in IT - you think they built a security structure capable of storing untold terabytes (or whatever the largest byte designation is now) because they *weren't* going to keep tabs on as many people as possible?

[aTm]

They came for the terrorists, but I said nothing because I was not a terrorist.

[Owlman]

What does spying on the German Chancellor have anything to do with national security?

as far as I know nothing. But it does mean that Snowden released a hell of a lot more information than necessary based on his so-called goals and that much of it was of national security and our foreign capabilities. I have no sympathy for Snowden. He is not a hero.